Olympic Speedskating

[Han Solo]

Was watching the speedskating competition over the weekend. Noticed the world record was boken several times, and the announcers seemed to be falling all over themselves talking about how fast the ice was.

So I'm curious. How do they make a "faster" ice than on other tracks?

[Dr T Non-Fan]

Even more telling: why are there world records in this sport, if the ice is so important? That's similar to a world record in a marathon. Or lowest round of golf.

I think the ice isn't just tap water. Some bunch of chemicals, combined with the way it's frozen and maintained.

Hockey has issues with varying ice surfaces, mostly due to basketball courts being put on top of them, and due to the heat and humidity of the air of the arena.

[Patience]

1) High altitude

2) Great atmospheric conditions within the building (proper humidity, etc)

all records are based on the conditions, altitude, track surface ... I don't see this as being different. Its as fast as anyone has ever gone for that distance on ice.

Marathons have totally different layouts, elevations, upslopes & down, and road surfaces. One of the biggest difference in a sport. & they propbly do have an olympic marathon record.

[Dr T Non-Fan]

I know they do have these records. Whether they are important or not is a different argument.
Marathons should have some factor to adjust for elevation changes and altitude.

[Pseudolus]

Are Mexico City (high-altitude) track-and-field records treated differently than "normal" records? I seem to recall that they are.

[Patience]

I don't believe so, I think officially Bob Beamon had the official long jump record, even if there was an asterisk (for the elevation) I don't believe they kept any alternative record.

[Kid Rock]

The texture of the ice can make a difference. If the ice is softer, it will be slow. The smoother it is, the less friction there is when gliding. That is why speed skating is more of an indoor evcent now. In the 1980 games, it was held outside on the Lake Placid High School Track.

[Dr T Non-Fan]

I was going to mention Beamon's record as being attached to the phrase "at altitude."

While it wasn't officially *'d, the conventional wisdom referred to it that way.

Then I wondered why there weren't more T&F events held at high altitude. Then, why aren't they ALL held at high altitude?

[Actuary321]

On 2002-02-11 15:38, Dr T Non-Fan wrote:
I was going to mention Beamon's record as being attached to the phrase "at altitude."

While it wasn't officially *'d, the conventional wisdom referred to it that way.

Then I wondered why there weren't more T&F events held at high altitude. Then, why aren't they ALL held at high altitude?


Altitude would be good for most of the F but the T events would be best held as close to sea level as possible. At altitude the air is thinner which provides less wind resistance and there is actually some lessening of gravity, though I don't know if it would make a difference in most events either TorF. But the problem with holding Track events at altitude is that there is less air which means less oxygen which you need.

Many athletes train at altitude so that their systems get used to working hard to get the oxygen out of the air. Then they go compete at lower altitudes and have more stamina. I have experienced this it is real.

[egg]

The reasons they cited for why the ice is fast:
1) Altitude (Less Air resistance)
2) The ceiling is lower in the Utah venue than at Nagano, therefore it is easier to control the environment, which leads to "better ice" (not soft).

There is such a thing as a fast swimming pool also.

[Dr T Non-Fan]

I'll concede that point. Except for the shortest sprints.
I guess there is some break-even point in the speed of an object/person versus altitude. Think javelin speed versus miler speed.
The speed skaters are going 30+ mph! Wind resistence is key, as noted by the funky outfits. Perhaps a swirl caused by open doors might make them go faster?

[Kid Rock]

On the train yesterday, I read a story on the guy that is responsible for the ice at the track in SLC. It is purifed water and go on one layer at a time. There is something like 20 layers that are quite thin. The temperature is regulated by the distance. For the sprints, the temperature is raised to soften the track slightly. This increases the grip. For the longer races, the track is made harder so that there is less friction.

The 500M race is exciting. It's too bad one of the top skaters fell 15 feet from the start last night. Prediction: Canadian skater will finish last and set world record.

[Actuary321]

The Utah Olympic Oval, as it is called had some problems when they were building it. They had to tear out and repour most of the concrete because of something that happened during the initial pour (bad conditions, wrong formula for the concrete or something) that would have an effect on the ice. Then the roof collapsed. It was engineered to be the fastest ice in the world.

[tan]
And in Speedskating if you fall down you lose. Not the same in Figure skating.

[Ducky]

Anybody catch any of the short-track speedskating last night? Quite entertaining to see 6 people trying to jockey for position as they trip each other up & slide into the barriers around the rink.

[Pseudolus]

Am I the only person who starts singing "You can be my Apolo Anton Ohno..." every time they show that guy?

(probably)

[Anonymous]

On 2002-02-14 11:38, Pseudolus wrote:
Am I the only person who starts singing "You can be my Apolo Anton Ohno..." every time they show that guy?

(probably)


You're not the only one, thank God.

[Kid Rock]

I watched the short-track skating last night. It started with 4 teams, so the changes were with 8 guys. This kept up until the Koreans and Australians fell and they re-started.

I thought the Ohno story was OK during the opening ceremonies, but after watching the race at the trials that was accused of being fixed, I don't like the story as much. The race looked odd. He is the fastest guy, did the fastest laps last night and never tried to pass during that race. Coincidently, he seemed to always be right in front of the guy that was in fourth who needed to win.

[Woody]

On this website, scrol down to GRAPHICS in the orange box and they give a good graphic representation of why the ice is faster.

http://www.usatoday.com/olympics/saltlake/front.htm

[egg]

But who comes out and paints the flags on the ice before each pair? And why doesn't that slow them down.

[Dr T Non-Fan]

Not only that, but how do they repaint tham after each lap?