Poker: Yes, Fold, No, Maybe, No

[Expunge]

*********** # 82 **************
PokerStars Game #302185100: Tournament #1055430, Hold'em No Limit - Level VI (100/200) - 2004/02/23 - 19:43:49 (ET)
Table '1055430 1' Seat #7 is the button
Seat 2: Shpink (3175 in chips)
Seat 4: T-ITUP (2900 in chips)
Seat 6: caps 25 (3910 in chips)
Seat 7: ryan5823 (2220 in chips)
Seat 9: SP0NGE (1295 in chips)
SP0NGE: posts small blind 100
Shpink: posts big blind 200
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to SP0NGE [Kd Jd]
T-ITUP: folds
caps 25: folds
ryan5823: folds
SP0NGE: raises 200 to 400
Shpink: calls 200
*** FLOP *** [Td 7c Ad]
SP0NGE: bets 895 and is all-in
Shpink: calls 895
*** TURN *** [Td 7c Ad] [4h]
*** RIVER *** [Td 7c Ad 4h] [Qd]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
SP0NGE: shows [Kd Jd] (a Royal Flush)
Shpink: shows [2d 7d] (a flush, Ace high)
SP0NGE collected 2590 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 2590 | Rake 0
Board [Td 7c Ad 4h Qd]
Seat 2: Shpink (big blind) showed [2d 7d] and lost with a flush, Ace high
Seat 4: T-ITUP folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: caps 25 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: ryan5823 (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: SP0NGE (small blind) showed [Kd Jd] and won (2590) with a Royal Flush

*********** # 83 **************
PokerStars Game #302186205: Tournament #1055430, Hold'em No Limit - Level VI (100/200) - 2004/02/23 - 19:44:33 (ET)
Table '1055430 1' Seat #9 is the button
Seat 2: Shpink (1880 in chips)
Seat 4: T-ITUP (2900 in chips)
Seat 6: caps 25 (3910 in chips)
Seat 7: ryan5823 (2220 in chips)
Seat 9: SP0NGE (2590 in chips)
Shpink: posts small blind 100
T-ITUP: posts big blind 200
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to SP0NGE [Ts 5d]
Shpink said, "royal"
SP0NGE said, "yup first one"
caps 25: folds
ryan5823: folds
SP0NGE: folds
caps 25 said, "wow"
Shpink: folds
T-ITUP collected 200 from pot
T-ITUP: shows [4d 8c] (high card Eight)
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 200 | Rake 0
Seat 2: Shpink (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 4: T-ITUP (big blind) collected (200)
Seat 6: caps 25 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: ryan5823 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: SP0NGE (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)

*********** # 84 **************
PokerStars Game #302186848: Tournament #1055430, Hold'em No Limit - Level VI (100/200) - 2004/02/23 - 19:44:59 (ET)
Table '1055430 1' Seat #2 is the button
Seat 2: Shpink (1780 in chips)
Seat 4: T-ITUP (3000 in chips)
Seat 6: caps 25 (3910 in chips)
Seat 7: ryan5823 (2220 in chips)
Seat 9: SP0NGE (2590 in chips)
T-ITUP: posts small blind 100
caps 25: posts big blind 200
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to SP0NGE [Js Ks]
ryan5823: calls 200
SP0NGE: calls 200
Shpink: folds
T-ITUP: folds
caps 25: checks
*** FLOP *** [3s Kd 2h]
caps 25: checks
ryan5823: bets 400
SP0NGE: raises 1990 to 2390 and is all-in
caps 25: folds
ryan5823: calls 1620 and is all-in
SP0NGE said, "nh"
*** TURN *** [3s Kd 2h] [2c]
*** RIVER *** [3s Kd 2h 2c] [Ah]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
ryan5823: shows [Ac Ad] (a full house, Aces full of Deuces)
SP0NGE: shows [Js Ks] (two pair, Kings and Deuces)
Shpink said, "ez com ez go"
ryan5823 collected 4740 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 4740 | Rake 0
Board [3s Kd 2h 2c Ah]
Seat 2: Shpink (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: T-ITUP (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 6: caps 25 (big blind) folded on the Flop
Seat 7: ryan5823 showed [Ac Ad] and won (4740) with a full house, Aces full of Deuces
Seat 9: SP0NGE showed [Js Ks] and lost with two pair, Kings and Deuces

*********** # 85 **************
PokerStars Game #302188187: Tournament #1055430, Hold'em No Limit - Level VI (100/200) - 2004/02/23 - 19:45:52 (ET)
Table '1055430 1' Seat #4 is the button
Seat 2: Shpink (1780 in chips)
Seat 4: T-ITUP (2900 in chips)
Seat 6: caps 25 (3710 in chips)
Seat 7: ryan5823 (4740 in chips)
Seat 9: SP0NGE (370 in chips)
caps 25: posts small blind 100
ryan5823: posts big blind 200
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to SP0NGE [Ad 3s]
SP0NGE: raises 170 to 370 and is all-in
Shpink: folds
ryan5823 said, "ty"
T-ITUP: folds
caps 25: folds
charlietuna [observer] said, "i missed that one what happened?"
ryan5823: calls 170
*** FLOP *** [8d 2s As]
*** TURN *** [8d 2s As] [8c]
*** RIVER *** [8d 2s As 8c] [9h]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
ryan5823: shows [Qh 7d] (a pair of Eights)
SP0NGE: shows [Ad 3s] (two pair, Aces and Eights)
SP0NGE collected 840 from pot
Shpink said, "i called an all in, he got a royal str8 flush"
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 840 | Rake 0
Board [8d 2s As 8c 9h]
Seat 2: Shpink folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: T-ITUP (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: caps 25 (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 7: ryan5823 (big blind) showed [Qh 7d] and lost with a pair of Eights
Seat 9: SP0NGE showed [Ad 3s] and won (840) with two pair, Aces and Eights

*********** # 86 **************
PokerStars Game #302189270: Tournament #1055430, Hold'em No Limit - Level VI (100/200) - 2004/02/23 - 19:46:35 (ET)
Table '1055430 1' Seat #6 is the button
Seat 2: Shpink (1780 in chips)
Seat 4: T-ITUP (2900 in chips)
Seat 6: caps 25 (3610 in chips)
Seat 7: ryan5823 (4370 in chips)
Seat 9: SP0NGE (840 in chips)
ryan5823: posts small blind 100
SP0NGE: posts big blind 200
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to SP0NGE [7h Ah]
ryan5823 said, "stayin alive sponge :-)"
Shpink: calls 200
T-ITUP: folds
charlietuna [observer] said, "what was his hole cards?"
caps 25: calls 200
ryan5823: folds
SP0NGE: raises 640 to 840 and is all-in
Shpink: calls 640
Shpink said, "kg d"
caps 25 said, "k j dia"
Shpink said, "kq"
Shpink said, "whatever"
caps 25: folds
*** FLOP *** [Ac 2d 5s]
*** TURN *** [Ac 2d 5s] [9c]
*** RIVER *** [Ac 2d 5s 9c] [Qs]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
SP0NGE: shows [7h Ah] (a pair of Aces)
Shpink: shows [Qc Ad] (two pair, Aces and Queens)
charlietuna [observer] said, " nh"
Shpink said, "gg"
Shpink collected 1980 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 1980 | Rake 0
Board [Ac 2d 5s 9c Qs]
Seat 2: Shpink showed [Qc Ad] and won (1980) with two pair, Aces and Queens
Seat 4: T-ITUP folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: caps 25 (button) folded before Flop
Seat 7: ryan5823 (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 9: SP0NGE (big blind) showed [7h Ah] and lost with a pair of Aces

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[MNBridge]

Deleted post because I read betting and pot size wrong.

[Expunge]

Why all in on the flop? I would think a bet of 400 would make him fold if he has nothing.
You are third in chips and want to make the $. Caps has no reason to gamble, he is chip leader.

If he calls an all in you are beat.
If he calls 400 you are probably beat.
If he comes over the top of your bet you are beat.

3 reasons for all in) 1. Want the other player to fold with a hand that MAY later beat yours, 2. You want a call cause you will have the best hand even of the hands that can call. 3. Desparation time - Bluff

#1) You PROBABLY have the best hand but if you are winning now you will should be winning at the end. Or was it possible Ryan came in with 45 in first position? (there are no other drawing hands out there.)
#2) Your hand isn't that strong.
#3) You aren't bluffing


Can't I say I wouldn't have done the same thing you did.
But I still don't think it's the best play.

On the flop pot size is 700. 400 is bet into me. (A weak bet as if trying to steal). Danger hands are 22,33,KK,AA,KQ,AK. or 2 pair from the big blind. Preflop was limps around, likely eliminates AK, and KK. 400 bet into me, likely not the case if 22, or 33 or two pair. (they would either slowplay or come in for more). So its AA or KQ that can beat me. 1100 int the pot action on me with 2390 in chips. Calling here is prob not a good idea. I will get sucked dry if i have to call it down to the river. So to come over the top i need to raise to 1200 at a minimum otherwise its not worth it. If i get called and am currently beat i have a fair number of outs, 2K's 3J's and runner runner flush. The tournament is in level (vi) so its been running over 50 minutes and has only knocked out 4 players for a single sng $5 this is incredibly long and closing in on crap shoot time anyways.

Fold may be the best option, but tough to get away from top pair in this situation.

[Expunge]

btw i semi watched as i played some heads up games.

Total time for this $5 9 player SnG. 1 hour 35 minutes.

[Expunge]

BTW i would like more comments on the KJ hand above. Could this be our hand discussion of the day?

[MNBridge]

I'm editing my above post because I miised the following very imprtant data:

I missed his 400 bet on the flop.
I also missed that the blinds were 300 in the pot, making pot 700 + his bet = 1100 before you acted.

At this point I think you did the right move. Pre flop see below.

[MNBridge]

OK I'm going to go back to the start of the hand.

The large stack comes in in first position (obviously not just trying to pick up the blinds as there is no raise.)

Throw KJ into the muck. This is a play I think I actually would do. When the tournament gets to 5 people or less I only go against the big stack when I think I have a hand I can double up with. Here there is a good chance you are playing with a weaker hand than him. Not good.

Was he stealing a lot of blinds? Coming in without a raise often then betting? How was he playing?

[Expunge]

OK I'm going to go back to the start of the hand.

The large stack comes in in first position (obviously not just trying to pick up the blinds as there is no raise.)

Throw KJ into the muck. This is a play I think I actually would do. When the tournament gets to 5 people or less I only go against the big stack when I think I have a hand I can double up with. Here there is a good chance you are playing with a weaker hand than him. Not good.

Was he stealing a lot of blinds? Coming in without a raise often then betting? How was he playing?

nope a smaller stack came in, big stack was in the bb and folded on the flop.

[Bama Gambler]

My thoughts on the KJ hand:

Fold pre-flop. The only kinds of hands that I will limp with pre-flop are hands that don't make second best hands (e.g. small pair). If it was folded to me (if ryan5823 didn't limp) then I might raise to 600 to steal the blinds), but once he limped it's an easy fold. This hand easily makes second best hands. What if someone raised behind you on pre-flop? These hands will get you in trouble more often than not. You will only get action if you are beat.

[Bama Gambler]

Regarding the flop play on the KJ hand:

Either you are beat and he will call your all-in or he has 2 or 3 outs. 2 outs if he has a pocket pair < K and 3 outs if he has Kx where x < J. So why raise all-in? Just call. That way if you are beat then it won't cost you as many chips and if you are beating him you can get more chips if he continues to bluff at the pot. Actually by calling the 400 on the flop you can be pretty sure if he bets big on the turn you are beat (unless he is a crazy player - which you should know at this point in the tournament).