View Full Version : Course 4 - 4/15/2002 - What did you think?
Maximus
05-15-2002, 03:05 PM
I thought this exam was much more difficult than the previous 4 given.
Hopin' to Pass
05-15-2002, 03:21 PM
:swear:
I agree completely. I felt like I took a pretty severe beating after leaving the exam room! Anyone have a guess on what the pass mark might be this time?
Crystal Dragon.
05-15-2002, 03:25 PM
I had no problems whatsoever with it...
oh yeah; didn't take it! :o
(sorry, couldn't resist!!) :D
Moderator1
05-15-2002, 03:28 PM
It's awfully early to be discussing this exam. Someone suggested 24 hours after the exam had finished in Hawaii (6 hours after eastern time), which would be 7:30 PM eastern time tomorrow.
At an absolute minimum, please refrain from discussing specific questions or posting any answers until tomorrow.
Macroman
05-15-2002, 03:33 PM
I think it's 5/15/02...
Course 4 Escapee
05-15-2002, 03:38 PM
This was definitely the toughest Course 4 yet. What's more frustrating is that somone that passed it in May or Nov of 2000 needed to know/understand considerably less to pass than they would now.
:swear:
Course 4 Escapee
05-15-2002, 03:40 PM
This was definitely the toughest Course 4 yet. What's more frustrating is that somone that passed it in May or Nov of 2000 needed to know/understand considerably less to pass than they would now.
:swear:
Hopin' to Pass
05-15-2002, 03:53 PM
I'm pretty irritated about it, too. Those who passed in 2000 have no idea how lucky they are!
Macroman
05-15-2002, 04:08 PM
This was definitely the toughest Course 4 yet. What's more frustrating is that somone that passed it in May or Nov of 2000 needed to know/understand considerably less to pass than they would now.
:swear:
old story, they have gradually added new material and tougher and different questions to the exams over the years.
Maximus
05-15-2002, 04:20 PM
You are right macroman, in saying that the above scenario is an "Old Story", but I think most would agree that there is a much bigger dose of it this time around.
Macroman
05-15-2002, 04:32 PM
If that's the case (I have no way to know), it will probably serve to suppress the pass mark. In any event I would not spend a lot of time stressing about it.
Tri4Ben
05-15-2002, 04:41 PM
The SOA has to keep making the exams harder because everybody studies the past exams and knows how to do those questions. They either need to keep the pass mark the same and make the questions more difficult or they need to raise the pass mark. We know which the SOA decided on.
I was frustrated by a few questions I had never seen before (wont give specifics yet). All I could know is the stuff that I studied and another 50 hours wouldn't have made me learn how to do those questions.
I hope the pass mark is about is in the very low 20s, I wont be able to handle this another time.
Course 4 Escapee
05-15-2002, 05:26 PM
I got a 4 on the May 2000 exam and a 5 on the Nov 2000 exam. I have since gotten two consecutive 3's and this sitting, assuming the pass mark is about the same, was probably around a 3 also. While I am obviously no exam stud, I have never done worse on subsequent sittings on exams before (I have 165 pre-conversion credits). I have studied (despite not having study time at work plus a wife and three kids) about 100-150 hours each of the last three times. Do I really understand the material less than three sittings ago?
What is the society really trying to accomplish? Is it to test whether somebody has sufficient understanding of the material in order to do their job? Or, is it just to manipulate the exams via increased difficulty, trickery and obscurity so that they can keep the pass rate from being too high?
If it's the former: then they're wildly inconsistent. If it's the latter: mission accomplished.
Actuary321
05-15-2002, 05:31 PM
What is the society really trying to accomplish? Is it to test whether somebody has sufficient understanding of the material in order to do their job? Or, is it just to manipulate the exams via increased difficulty, trickery and obscurity so that they can keep the pass rate from being too high?
If it's the former: then they're wildly inconsistent. If it's the latter: mission accomplished.
It's probably somewhere in the middle and they come out somewhere in the middle too. :horse:
Tri4Ben
05-15-2002, 05:38 PM
What is that an emoticon of anyway, is it three happy faces yelling at, whipping and eating a dead cow/deer?
"Four-time Course 4 Loser wrote:
What is the society really trying to accomplish? Is it to test whether somebody has sufficient understanding of the material in order to do their job? Or, is it just to manipulate the exams via increased difficulty, trickery and obscurity so that they can keep the pass rate from being too high?
If it's the former: then they're wildly inconsistent. If it's the latter: mission accomplished."
They say they are the former, then turn around and do the latter
Higher Authority
05-15-2002, 05:45 PM
I didn't think it was that bad. There were some new twists, but then again all of the exams have new twists.
Snicker
05-15-2002, 05:53 PM
Tri4ben: It's beating a dead horse. I think it's rather disturbing, especially when you see the blood splatters.
My sympathies to ALL of you. I looked here with some interest because I FINALLY passed course 4 last fall (on the 4th attempt, after two 5's in a row), and wondered how bad it was this time around. Sounds like it was awful. I personally think this exam is the most gawd awful thing I ever had to take. I too had an ok pass record before 2000, and felt screwed in the conversion by missing out on getting credit for 4 by failing 160 in the fall of 1999. I then spent the next 2 years trying to learn credibility theory and loss dbns and re-learn time series. What a waste of my time. I will probably never use anything even remotely related to Course 4 in my job. I finally passed by using the ASM manual (the only manual I found that did a decent job of pulling together the syllabus). I went to an NEAS seminar the sitting I got the first 5, and that was of some help, but obviously not enough to help me pass for another year.
Don't get down on yourselves too much now, they may end up setting the passing score very low. I think it's been in the low 20's so far, maybe it will fall lower this time if the exam really was that bad.
By the way, if you did fail and you don't have ASM, get it. I swear without it I wouldn't have passed last fall and I'd be in a new career by now!
I thought Course 6 was a lot more fun and interesting (I didn't think it was fun and interesting, just MORE fun and interesting than Course 4!) to study for, and could actually see some vague, indirect correlation to my work. (Unlike 4.) Hang in there, it's a great feeling to be finally "over the hump" and past the math exams...
I thought this was a super hard exam! This was my first attempt at Course 4 and it was an eye-opener. I'm definitly feeling discouraged. :(
This test was BRUTAL. If I pass, it will definitely be because of ASM. I was able to recognize some problem types that didn't appear on the past four exams. At least, I HOPE I recognized them ... :wink:
Oscar
05-15-2002, 07:02 PM
Being my 4th attempt, and haiving taken 3 in May 2000...I'm certain they are getting more difficult. I'm glad I knocked 3 out on the first attempt; as I'm sure it's tougher now.
My theory: these exams will stop getting more difficult with each round because they are not releasing them for awhile. They had to make them harder now because we've all worked every one of them. I figured this test would not cover new topics (correct for them most part), but instead just have more complex versions of previous problems - exactly. Next sitting won't need to be more difficult 'cause no one can study this.
Personally, I can't do lots of algebra with decimals and multiple eqauions as I'm panicking - it's like trying to hold your hand steady when your nervous. I did pretty good on the theory, less computational type.
thanks for indulging me,
trinity
05-15-2002, 07:09 PM
I think it's harder than the previous exams. What the pass mark is? ? :-?
phdmom
05-16-2002, 09:24 AM
Hmmm...I didn't think it was all that bad. I felt pretty happy when I left the test. I thought there was quite a jump in difficulty between the May 2001 and Nov. 2001 exams. I'm not sure I thought this one was harder than November's.
One of my study strategies in the last couple of days was to study stuff that hadn't been on any previous exam, and that definitely paid off.
phdmom
05-16-2002, 09:27 AM
sorry...didn't mean to double post
clayjars
05-16-2002, 09:38 AM
I think the pass mark was 22 last sitting. I know someone that passed with 22 and I got a 5 (with 21 correct). Everyone said the 11/01 test was more difficult than the 5/01 test which appeared to have a pass mark of 23 based some old postings. If this test was more difficult than last, I would guess a pass mark of 21 because I think they will keep the mark above 50%.
Caramel
05-16-2002, 09:48 AM
What is the society really trying to accomplish? Is it to test whether somebody has sufficient understanding of the material in order to do their job? Or, is it just to manipulate the exams via increased difficulty, trickery and obscurity so that they can keep the pass rate from being too high?
If it's the former: then they're wildly inconsistent. If it's the latter: mission accomplished.
Hey, first of all, please don't name yourself as "Four-time Course 4 Loser" because you already gained all my respect for not giving up! You have a family to take care after and you did an amazing job to stick with the painful studying!
Second, I completely agree with you that SOA is pretty good at making exams obscure and uselessly difficulty (sometimes I don't even know if they speak proper English! Just look at the wording of their exam questions, you have no clue what the hell they want you to do!) rather than HELPING us to make sure we have a REASONABLE understanding of the materials.
But, what can we do? Over throw the Big Brother? I would if I could...
zoeandnimo
05-16-2002, 09:57 AM
When are we allowed to discuss the questions?? I'm dying to see how I did on some of them.
Actuary321
05-16-2002, 11:06 AM
Traci posted something here http://www.actuary.ca/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=4085
Others in that thread notably DTNF suggest 24 hours after the exam starts in Hawaii, which I believe for course 4 would be tonight at 7:30 pm Eastern Time.
Anyone think we really should wait until May 23rd? That is what the SOA does/did on their site but this site has never been THAT anal.
zoeandnimo
05-16-2002, 11:08 AM
Looks like Course 6 started discussing questions already....
:argue:
I thought Nov. 2001 was very difficult. This was in that range, but I didn't think it was quite as difficult.
HomerJ
05-16-2002, 03:29 PM
DONUTS!!!!!!!!!!
phdmom: I followed a similar strategy. In November, it seemed like they worked hard to find problem types that had not been covered. It worked out well for me to memorize some formulas that had not been needed in the first four exams.
Trout
05-16-2002, 10:36 PM
I am surprised to see so much complaints on this exam. I really just thought it was not difficult. Anyway, it is over. So have some fun.
Retired Bookworm
05-17-2002, 03:15 AM
I thought the exam was much easier than prior exams for one reason alone: 4th time ... ah well still doesn't mean I passed. I noticed that ASM was much more in line with the exam than Actex was, this being my first time using ASM, I felt ten times more familiar with the exam questions.
Homer: I agree completely!!!
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