Nov Course 2 Study Suggestions:

I've never had this material. How should I study? Focus on Interest Theory, Finance and Micro?

[Brutè]

I had never seen the material before either. I focused on Interest theory and Micro. I was very weak in finance and macro. I passed with a 6. It was not my first attempt, but it was my first attempt where I really put a lot of time into it and studied every day.

How long do you guys think is neccessary to learn the material? If I started the beginning of August, would I be able to sit in November? Also, are the texts a neccessity, or do you think study guides (CSM or Temple Pack) would do a good enough job summarizing the info? I think I'd rather go with the guides, since the texts are pricey, but if the texts are the way to go, please let me know. I haven't been exposed to most of this stuff before, so I want to make sure I buy the best study materials.

[Brutè]

Personally I found the texts to be useful. Especially the Price Theory book. However, I would not spend a lot of time doing the book problems as they are not really a good preparation for exam type problems (this is for all the books). I would not read the Wachtel study note for Macro (won't save you any money since its free on the website but will save you lots of time). The Finance book was the least useful to me, but as I said, I did not concentrate too much on that. What I did learn I got from various study guides.

re study guides: I found the Actex to be quite UNhelpful for C2. I liked the CSM manual ans supplement. It has so many problems that if you are aggressive and can get through them all you should be ok.

Do not wait until mid August. Start now. This minute, if possible. Even if you don't have the textbooks, start reading the macro note.

Now, with that said, this is what I did.

I took the exam twice. The first time, I read most of the text for Micro and Finance, sort of understood the macro note (understood it really well for Chapter 1 and 3, not so much for 2 and 4. Glanced at Ch 5). Waited too long to look at Interest theory, since my thinking was that since I was a math major, I would be able to pick it up. This didn't work for Chapters 6-7 of that book.

I also took one seminar and used Actex. I got a 4.

Now, here's what I'd recommend.

First off, I'm assuming that you don't have any materials. Great, you've still got the macro note. It's easily the hardest thing to understand. Read through it once, get a general feel of it. You'll notice that later chapters will state the basic ideas of previous chapters. When you get there, go back to that chapter, and make sure you understand that idea.

Next, take notes on each of the chapters, make sure you understand everything except the proofs for the formulas in Chapter 2 and the partial derivitives in Chapter 3. Do a chapter of notes a night. Put little flags by the notes that you write that you don't understand. This will take about 10 hours of study time, total.

Now, read through your notes, and get to a library. Get a book on Macro, and use it to help you understand what the notes don't cover. Once you understand your notes, keep looking them over, use it as a study break from other things.

If you use a weekend to do this, you won't lose much total time. Macro questions are the least frequent, but if you can understand that note, most of them are pretty easy.

Now, if you have the textbooks, read them for Micro and Finanace. Micro is very easy to read, but don't rush through it. I found it helpful to outline Chapters 3,4 and 7 in particular. Use the old exams as a reference here. Also, check out the old CAS part 5A exams, for questions both in Micro and Macro.

Stay away from Actex for Micro.

I found the Finance book fun to read, but there is ALOT of information to understand, and those "which of these questions is true" can come from anywhere. Make sure you read all the assigned chapters at least twice. Alot of people seemed to miss an easy question on the exam this last sitting because they skimmed Chapter 15, instead of putting the time in to read it. This is easily the hardest part to prepare for, since there are quite a bit of questions on the exam, and a ton of info to look at.

I found Actex to be useful for Finance, but dear god are there typos and mistakes. But, it does help with pricing options and provides a huge number of practice problems, so I think it worth it.

Finally, interest theory. Do not put this one off. I think I got the temple Interest theory study guide (I'll check to confirm) and it was excellent. Everything was broken down and there was a ton of practice problems to work with. Best of all, I was able to go through the entire thing in three weeks (minus the old exam questions).

For interest theory, make sure you understand the idea of the time value of money. Know the formulas from Chapter One cold, and draw a time line FOR EVERY PROBLEM.

I hope this helps. I aggressivly outlined the entire Micro book, up to chapter 12 of the finance book, and used the study guides mentioned above and got an 8 this time. Put the time in, and don't take shortcuts.

Good luck!

[fallout]

Am I the only one that thought "How to Pass 2" was helpful. I really liked it. It cuts right to the chase, and seems to give questions of the type you could expect to see. Each topic covered in 2 or 3 pages.

My approach for this exam:

I read the micro and finance texts, skipped the macro note and the Int theory text. I went through the entire CSM manual, and did a whole bunch of problems from the CSM Supplement. Then the week before the exam decided to open the H2P2 book and really liked it. I read it straight through to the time of the exam.

Of course, my company buys my books so ordering a lot is not a big deal.

I got a 7 on this exam, studying for around 170 hours total.

[Brown Eyed Girl]

I agree with you fallout. I thought the How to Pass Manual was helpful once I knew the material fairly well. The CSM has tons of problems! The only textbook I read was the Micro text. Use the CSM to get a good handle on the material and then use How to Pass right before the exam.

I also got a 7 on my first try with about 180 hours

I didn't use any study manuals, so I have no basis for comparison, but I will say that it seems like for C2, unlike any other exam, the texts are essential. Everyone likes the Price Theory (micro) book, I also really liked the Finance book. Some people don't like the Interest Theory book as much. I did, but I also took a class in interest theory that used the same textbook. I would say that you should read every required chapter of all three textbooks. I would also recommend doing a little of each subject as you go along, rather than finishing one subject before you start another, because this way they will all be more fresh in your mind come exam time, and you will be more able to see how they overlap. The one exception to that is that you might want to do a lot of the interest theory before starting finance, because interest calculations (especially the time value of money) are fundamental to finance. Don't repeat my mistakes: my biggest mistake was not working enough problems. Work ALL of the old exam problems. A study manual might be great for extra problems, but like I said before, I can't recommend one. My other big mistake was not finding a proper balance of understanding and memorization. I understood interest theory well, and I found that I could work virtually any problem from first principles (i.e. set up a time line, set up a geometric series - perhaps with arithemetic coefficients, and sum the series). However, this can take a LONG time for the very complicated problems. I didn't want to memorize any formulas since I felt comfortable with my understanding of the principles, but it can save you a great amount of time if you can recall important formulas instantly.

[Bama Gambler]

First let me give you my background:

I took micro and macro in college (entry level business class so they were a joke - they hardly helped at all for course 2). I had no prior experience with finance or interest theory.

How did I do?

I got a 9 on my first try.

Genereal thoughts:

I believe the interest theory is BY FAR the most important subject for this material. You can do a lot of the "finance" problems just using interest theory. Don't waste your time with the macro study note (more on this later). Make sure you get through ALL of the material a month before the exam. This will leave you plenty of time to work problem after problem. That is the only way to master the exam style questions. You have to be fast. If you start to get stuck on something move on. Come back to it later. Ask a friend. There is too much material to waste a lot of time on one concept.

What order should you tackle the material?

1. Interest Theory
2. Micro
3. Finance
4. Macro

But, if you get bored with one feel free to move onto something else. The most important thing to keep studying from now until the exam. I studied one hour before work, one or two hours at work (my work study time), and two hours on Sunday afternoons. Ocassionaly, I would stay after work and study for an hour or hour and half.

Which materials should I use?

First of all DO NOT work ANY of the problems from the textbooks. Complete waste of time.

#. Subject - (where to learn the material) & (where to work problems)

1. Interest Theory - textbook & (Batten or CSM)
2. Micro - textbook & CSM
3. Finance - HTP & CSM
4. Macro - HTP & CSM.

I didn't care for the Finance book. HTP outlines exactly which formulas & concepts you need to know and nothing more. BTW, I didn't use HTP for the interest theory. Another note about HTP, some of their problems have incorrect solutions. So if you think their example is wrong just move on. I still give the manual a 10 out of 10 for the finance and macro.

For the interest theory I read the first couple of chapters and then went to the NEAS seminar. Bob Batten is the man!! If you can attend a seminar where he is teaching then you will be able to get at least 90% of the interest theory problems correct. And you will be able to do them fast. In fact I finished the test in 3 hours. I left the exam room 45 minutes early!!

Good Luck!!
Bama Gambler

[fallout]

Bama,

How many hours do you think you used?

[Bama Gambler]

Hours studing at work: 100
Hours at seminar: 40
Personal Hours: 100

Of course that totals to 240. I may have studied too much but I didn't want to take a chance of failing. I need the $$!!

Everyone at my work says if you score higher than a 7 you studied too much. My problem is I don't know when I can score a 7. I think if you shoot for a 6 or 7 you get a 4 or 5. I just pick when I want to start studying and then I continue to study until exam day. I NEVER study more than four hours in one day (some of my coworkers start pulling all nighters when the exam gets close). I start studing less when it gets close to exam day. I can't study for longer than 2-3 hours without my mind wondering. I try to learn the material first, then master the problems a month before the exam.

Of course what the hell do I know? I have really only studied for one exam. My major in college was math (stats track) so I didn't really study that much for course 1.

Roll Tide,
Bama Gambler

[fallout]

I don't think you overstudied at all.

The bigeest trap you can fall into is studying like 100 - 150 hours for a siiting, failing and having to do it again. I have heard of people studying 3 or 4 times for an exam, logging over 600 hours, and never really giving it one good shot.

I was planning on studying 250 hours, but just couldn't find the time. I would have felt a lot better going in if I had had like another 40 hours to do Interest theory problems, but things turned out for the best.

The extra 70 hours you studied more than me was repaid in full with the extra 70 hours I had to spend sweating if my number would be there on the 12th.

[Bama Gambler]

Great points Fallout!! Lets look at an example:

Student A studies 300 hours on first attempt and makes a 7.
He/she get a $3000 raise effective immediatly.

Sudent B shoots for a 6. He/she studies 150 hours and make a 4. No raise. Student B thinks now he can study 150 more hours and make a 7 like student A, but again falls short with a 5. No raise. On third try student B studies another 150 and finally gets that damn 6. Finally a raise!!

Total Study hours:
A - 300
B - 450

Plus, A made at least $3000 more by passing on the first try. Maybe more if A passed the next exam on the first try. Conclusion, it really pays to pass on the first try. I will continue to shoot for 9s and 10s, that way if I fall short I will still pass.

Give 'em hell Bama!!

Forgive my ignorance, but what is HTP ?

[Bama Gambler]

HTP = How to Pass
You can order it at www.actuarialbookstore.com

Wow. I feel so much more prepared in terms of how to approach studying and what to use. Thanks to everybody for your advice, especially you Bama Gambler. I think if I buget my time right, I'll have enough time to prepare for C2, go to classes, and keep up with my teaching. Have a good weekend everyone, and thanks again for the responses.

[Summer]

Thanks for the advice everyone!

I really was wondering about time management (how many hours to put in a solid performance).

I think I am going to aim for 300 hours. maybe even more if i have the time. i would much rather overstudy adn get a 9, then to understudy and get a 5.

[fallout]

<sniff> <sniff>

They always like Bama's advice better than mine.

fallout takes his 7 and goes home.

Thanks for all the advice!!

[neofan]

I don't think you overstudied at all.

The bigeest trap you can fall into is studying like 100 - 150 hours for a siiting, failing and having to do it again. I have heard of people studying 3 or 4 times for an exam, logging over 600 hours, and never really giving it one good shot.

I was planning on studying 250 hours, but just couldn't find the time. I would have felt a lot better going in if I had had like another 40 hours to do Interest theory problems, but things turned out for the best.

The extra 70 hours you studied more than me was repaid in full with the extra 70 hours I had to spend sweating if my number would be there on the 12th.


This was my biggest mistake with C1 and I won't let this happen again. Another advantage of doing well (8 or above), is that once you walk out of the exam room, you feel completely confident that you'll pass and can start studying for next one rather than wasting 2 months til the results are posted.

Let's get this straight.

These exams are not a reliable measure of a candidate’s knowledge of the material.
Further, contrary to what some may want to believe, they are definitely not a measure of intelligence either. The majority of their purpose is, in the tradition of Course 2, to act as a barrier to entry thereby enabling the SOA's monopoly on insurance professionals, which don't get me wrong will benefit all of us if we choose to continue with the process.
Just as important as raw knowledge are a candidates test taking skills, including speed and clarity of thought under pressure. Granted there must be some knowledge of the material in order to pass, except in exceptional circumstances, but just knowing the material better than others is not a guarantee of passing. It seems as though some with the aforementioned skills are able to pass with less knowledge of the material than others.
If the SOA were really interested in testing knowledge, the exams would be different. It seems as though the SOA makes the exams difficult to pass, not by asking insightful questions on difficult material, but rather by asking tricky questions on the average level of difficulty topics and imposing a time limit which barely allows enough time to answer enough questions correctly to pass. I believe one reason the SOA does this is that the people on the exam committees often don't understand the material as well as the previously mentioned changes would require, and because they are too cheap to hire academics, who really know the material, to make the exams.
Then again, once you realize the purpose of the exams, it really becomes superfluous for them to change. Why put forth effort and money to improve the means when you get the same ends? Well, kind of the same ends. Who cares if we give the wrong candidates a hard time?

[fallout]

The purpose of the exams seems to be to limit the amount of candidates getting through and thus adding value to the designations that is received. Only the true cream of the crop get through.

If you want an insurance related course that is easy to pass, or at least takes a lot less time, take LOMA. Of course, the value of a Fellowship in LOMA does not compare to one from the SOA.

The only thing you have to ask yourself, is "is it worth it to me??

[takin 2]

For courses 1-4 you could also say that anyone who got a 5 or 6 (maybe even a 4 or 7 in extreme cases) passed of failed based mainly on how well they guess at the questions they were unable to answer.

Multiple choice doesn't really reward those who know the material the best, but it ist he easiest to grade :D

[Uncledan]

How about Actex for Course2? is it useful compare with CSM? Should I buy CSM instand of Actex?

[Bama Gambler]

How about Actex for Course2? is it useful compare with CSM? Should I buy CSM instand of Actex?

Buy CSM.

[avocadoboy]

How about Actex for Course2? is it useful compare with CSM? Should I buy CSM instand of Actex?

Buy CSM.
I'm with Bama Gambler on this one. I used Actex for Course 2 and found it confusing.

[Uncledan]

So where I can buy it and how long it will take for shipping (I live in Toronto).

[Eeyore]

Uncledan I recently ordered mine online from actuarialbookstore.com
It took one week despite the heavy shipping costs

yeah, use the actuarial bookstore online.

But shipping will kill you. It's like 20% for Canada

Thanks for all the tips, Course 2 passers.

You've helped me alot. :D


Good luck on your next exam.

[Cambran]

#. Subject - (where to learn the material) & (where to work problems)

1. Interest Theory - textbook & (Batten or CSM)
2. Micro - textbook & CSM
3. Finance - HTP & CSM
4. Macro - HTP & CSM.



I've never heard of the Batten book before. Anyone know where I can find more information about it?

Thanks!

Cambran