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  #91  
Old 12-08-2017, 12:01 PM
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That's a pretty good summary. I've had bad managers who were bad communicators, who were outright dishonest, many others. I had one who told everybody nonstop what a great manager he was because "I don't get in anybody's way I just let them go and get their work done" - senior people all appreciated that but I was at a junior level and completely lost. If I had somebody like that now, I'd sing his praises.
When you had much less experience, did that boss just give you hard assignments that made you feel lost with minimal guidance, or too many easy assignments with no learning opportunity?
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  #92  
Old 12-08-2017, 12:17 PM
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what is meant by bad manager? Hates his job? Is bipolar? Doesn't give you credit? Doesn't challenge you?

Presumably a combination... but every manger is going to have something that ticks you off no?
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For an entry level report, it's an inability to guide and mentor. I almost left the profession after my experience with my first boss. He was a nice guy, and quite brilliant, actually. But he was a horrible communicator, and couldn't delegate anything he could do better himself, which was pretty much everything. I mostly organized the paperwork he hoarded and was perpetually confused.


"Personality differences" shouldn't be used for this determination . . .

But, a manager that will pass the buck on "short-comings" and holds the bag with "accolades" will be the biggest key that you have a "bad manager/supervisor".

The best managers that I've had (regardless of profession) are ones that will take the blame from the higher ups for your mistakes (but talks with you about them and helps you to address and correct them) and will give you (and the team) credit for successes (even if they were the one to have the key ideas).

You could also replace "mistake" with "things that went wrong" and "successes" with "things that went right".
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  #93  
Old 12-08-2017, 12:34 PM
Westley Westley is offline
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(responding to ronaldy)
That particular boss was when I was more mid-level experience but very new to consulting. And didn't give me assignments per se, just said "Take care of these clients". But when the clients had problems, or when I had problems with the clients, I didn't really know what to do. A lot of the art with clients is knowing when to say "Yes sir" and when to say "lol I know you didn't make such a ridiculous request lol, what do you actually want me to do you ignorant buffoon?"* If you don't have a senior person to help you parse through what's reasonable and what's not, or think through a way to understand why they're making the particular dumb request, then you're just kinda lost. And at the point I would bring him in, his advice would be something along the lines of "You should have dealt with this differently from the start".


*Not an actual quote of what I would say to a client


ETA: Not an unusual attitude in consulting IMO. Most firms compensate a lot more for sales and billing than for management and development. And the senior people are trying to get compensated.
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  #94  
Old 12-08-2017, 12:44 PM
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(responding to ronaldy)
That particular boss was when I was more mid-level experience but very new to consulting. And didn't give me assignments per se, just said "Take care of these clients". But when the clients had problems, or when I had problems with the clients, I didn't really know what to do. A lot of the art with clients is knowing when to say "Yes sir" and when to say "lol I know you didn't make such a ridiculous request lol, what do you actually want me to do you ignorant buffoon?"* If you don't have a senior person to help you parse through what's reasonable and what's not, or think through a way to understand why they're making the particular dumb request, then you're just kinda lost. And at the point I would bring him in, his advice would be something along the lines of "You should have dealt with this differently from the start".


*Not an actual quote of what I would say to a client


ETA: Not an unusual attitude in consulting IMO. Most firms compensate a lot more for sales and billing than for management and development. And the senior people are trying to get compensated.
I see, so you had one of those typical crappy managers who forgot what it's like to have less experience or just want to blame people for their misdirection.

What a nightmare. I would have left that kind of manager/company in a heartbeat.
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  #95  
Old 12-08-2017, 12:45 PM
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what is meant by bad manager? Hates his job? Is bipolar? Doesn't give you credit? Doesn't challenge you?

Presumably a combination... but every manger is going to have something that ticks you off no?
There are an unlimited number of ways to be a bad manager, but here are a few I have seen or heard about from friends:
1. Can't make a decision - asks you to do something a certain way, then at 5pm the day before the project is due decides it should be done completely differently... you work half the night only to have them change their mind, sometimes back to what you had done first. Causes you to miss deadlines making you look bad to clients. (I know several people who worked for this person, they all say the same thing.)
2. Not only doesn't give you credit for good work, calls you out very publicly for any mistake you make even ones they should have caught - this is tougher for entry level people but it still exists there. (Witnessed this as a peer of the a-hole.)
3. Is quasi-abusive - talks down to you, berates you for any minor mistake or lack of foresight in front of everyone... basically a total a-hole that makes you hate going to work. (I had one of these who was protected by the big boss who for some reason loved him. The big boss retired and the a-hole was fired within a few months.)
4. Is an idiot - can't explain anything to you because they don't understand it. Won't let you change/improve anything because they can't understand your improved work. (I also had one of these who was protected by the big boss who for some reason loved him. He eventually changed jobs and lasted about 2 months before being fired for being an idiot.)
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  #96  
Old 12-08-2017, 01:09 PM
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What a nightmare. I would have left that kind of manager/company in a heartbeat.
Well, it takes a while to realize how problematic it's going to be, and then after that to find another position, but was much less than a year.
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  #97  
Old 12-08-2017, 02:06 PM
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Sometimes, I feel like I'm not doing enough of things that I should be doing to expand my technical skillsets, etc.
This part says your boss is not as good as s/he should be. The other stuff isn't bad.
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  #98  
Old 12-08-2017, 02:14 PM
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This part says your boss is not as good as s/he should be. The other stuff isn't bad.
I agree with that. He's a young manager in his mid to late 30s.
If I feel like I'm not learning the technical stuffs, then I'm gonna start looking elsewhere in a couple of years after passing some more exams.
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  #99  
Old 12-08-2017, 02:22 PM
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I agree with that. He's a young manager in his mid to late 30s.
If I feel like I'm not learning the technical stuffs, then I'm gonna start looking elsewhere in a couple of years after passing some more exams.
Um. Have you talked to the manager about your desire to learn more technical stuff? Have you looked around for opportunities to make your job better by developing those skills on your own?
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  #100  
Old 12-08-2017, 02:26 PM
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I agree with that. He's a young manager in his mid to late 30s.
If I feel like I'm not learning the technical stuffs, then I'm gonna start looking elsewhere in a couple of years after passing some more exams.
In a couple of years is no time to be fixing the problem of not learning what you want to be learning in your job. That shit needs to be fixed ASAP. Get busy living or get busy dying. I'd give a job about 6 months tops to show me that it's going to teach me something that enriches my resume. That can involve some tweaking of the job description with the boss if things aren't looking good at first, but anything that's more than a year out on the boss's project timeline should be considered nonexistent from an underling analyst's point of view (IMO).

From what you wrote about the mix of work and the company culture, there might be potential for you to get your work mix shifted towards more interesting stuff. Your boss might be able to just make the change for you, or it may require some aggressive moves - like just going ahead and doing a project that everybody wishes were done but nobody requested (due to its benefits being diffuse) and then marketing it internally on your own slack time. These kind of moves can be great ways to jump the line if your company is the right kind of laid back.
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