Actuarial Outpost
 
Go Back   Actuarial Outpost > Exams - Please Limit Discussion to Exam-Related Topics > Exams - General
FlashChat Actuarial Discussion Preliminary Exams CAS/SOA Exams Cyberchat Around the World Suggestions



Exams - General Sub-fora: CFA exams
Non-specific topics and complaint department

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #21  
Old 03-07-2003, 11:12 AM
OlderMan OlderMan is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 34
Default

I used to work for "The Company you keep" back in the mid- to late-70's.
Their policy (then) was pass at least one exam every other sitting.
If you failed two sittings in a row, the company could fire you. However, if your job performance was good & you were well liked within he Actuarial Dep't, the company, at its option, could allow you one more try, or keep you on but outside the student program.
Most people were fired after two consecutive failures. Occasionally, someone was given a third chance.
If you got the third chance and failed, you were usually fired, but I can think of one case during my tenure where a person was kept on outside the student program.

The REALLY bright ones zipped through the exams, the not bright ones were left in their dust.

Of course a company that size had a fairly large turnover in students anyway. Some moved to NYC from outside the northeast US & didn't like the City. Some left to go to smaller companies or consulting firms. Some found they didn't want to be actuaries after all.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 03-07-2003, 11:24 AM
Maxine
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

In a former life of mine, a boss explained to me that people who were good employees could be kicked out of the program but would still be kept in the company. That boss said that the rules were set up as additional ammunition against poor performers so that it was just one more strike against them.

If your company has these types of rules in place, look around and see if there are any non-writers around. If there are non-writers around, and you have been getting good reviews from your boss, then you probably won't be fired if you fail, although you will probably lose your study time and exam fee pre-payment until you pass again.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 03-07-2003, 04:46 PM
new2for new2for is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 508
Default

but what I want to know is if these companies give their students mondo study time. Go ahead admit it. I know there are companies out there where the students study almost all day. I'm jealous.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 03-07-2003, 05:59 PM
OlderMan OlderMan is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 34
Default

When I was at "The Company You Keep" you got 3 days study time per hour of exam--15 days for a 5 hour exam. It was a 7 hour workday, so it works out to 105 hrs for a 5 hr exam. You had to take approx two-thirds as half days in the office. (They had study areas set aside.) The rest you could take as full days at home, in the office or where/however you wanted.

Additionally, if you worked on a BIG year-end project (Exhibit 8, Analysis of Incr in Res, Gain & Loss Exhibit, etc) you were given some compensatory study time for the overtime you put in. It wasn't one-for-one, but something like one-for-three or one-for-four, I think.

You sometimes did see people studying at their desks during slack periods, but this was frowned upon.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 03-07-2003, 06:56 PM
new2for new2for is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 508
Default

and they still fired you if you didn't pass. Not nice.
Well, maybe you just have to get lucky to fall into a place with generous study time.
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 03-07-2003, 08:08 PM
Buru Buru's Avatar
Buru Buru Buru Buru is offline
Member
Non-Actuary
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: hating the ao
Posts: 35,868
Default

It just seems weird to me that people would be fired for not passing exams. I find that there isn't necessarily a one to one correspondence between a good worker and a good exam taker. So, companies such as "The Company You Keep" would fire a super good worker for failing exams? That just seems so wrong!
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 03-07-2003, 08:25 PM
Pi Man Pi Man is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: ...has left the building
Posts: 4,753
Default

i've never seen a good employee fired outright for not passing. out of the program, sure. after 3 or 4 sittings without a pass, most just give up and look for a position in the company that doesn't require exams.

one schmoe really pushed his luck. what a chump. the company used the rules to drop his sorry butt.
__________________
as you wish
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 03-07-2003, 08:46 PM
Buru Buru's Avatar
Buru Buru Buru Buru is offline
Member
Non-Actuary
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: hating the ao
Posts: 35,868
Default

I guess that it is just a little different in pension consulting than insurance. The job title and work for exam/non exam takers isn't different in pensions.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 03-08-2003, 01:24 AM
Cynic
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Drunken Actuary
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cynic
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Drunken Actuary
What have I done to piss you off?
You know what you've done. 10K, that is.
Never mind. My original post was meant to be a compliment (I was just amazed at your ability to post and read through this forum so thoroughly).

Back to the topic, I've never seen anyone fired just because of failing exams. Most likely they are fired because of bad performance, and exams are part of it.
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 03-08-2003, 01:33 AM
The Drunken Actuary's Avatar
The Drunken Actuary The Drunken Actuary is offline
Member
CAS SOA Non-Actuary
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Favorite beer: Early and Often
Posts: 86,158
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cynic
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Drunken Actuary
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cynic
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Drunken Actuary
What have I done to piss you off?
You know what you've done. 10K, that is.
Never mind. My original post was meant to be a compliment (I was just amazed at your ability to post and read through this forum so thoroughly).
Ah, in that case, thank you. I thought it was an insult of some sort. I think I found another quote for my signature line!!!
__________________
I think the dollar will crash irreparably by 2012.... bottom drops out of the dollar. ....Dollars are worthless, 401ks are bust, the markets are valueless...government assumes control over all industry and everything is nationalized by the end of 2012. - gomer_tree
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:16 AM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
*PLEASE NOTE: Posts are not checked for accuracy, and do not
represent the views of the Actuarial Outpost or its sponsors.
Page generated in 0.43950 seconds with 11 queries