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  #11  
Old 06-28-2018, 09:12 AM
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ronaldy27 ronaldy27 is offline
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How about if you were working in an area that's specific but seen as important for every company like ERM?

I started out working in ERM as an analyst and I never got the traditional actuarial experience that actuaries usually start their careers with like pricing/reserving.
I do get small exposures to different roles in departments from capital modelling but that's it.

What are you guys' thoughts on my case?
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  #12  
Old 06-28-2018, 09:33 AM
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I think its important to find a role that you really enjoy and want to make a career out of. rotating or switching jobs early in your career is a great way to find your place in the profession. but dont think you HAVE to get pricing/reserving experience for the sake of getting it. I worked valuation for a while, didnt really like it, then switched to pricing where I see myself for the long haul.

I feel like rotations are just an extension of the new cookie cutter college programs- get BS in AS, get job in x, rotate to y, rotate to z-> have FSA +6 years (good place to be).

Just saying its 'a' path to follow, not 'the' path.

Also, working at a company with mandatory rotations, the departments with a lot of rotating students seem to suffer from a perpetual lack of experience- their processes never get updated and the people working them dont have a deep understanding of the methods.
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  #13  
Old 06-28-2018, 10:29 AM
Dr T Non-Fan Dr T Non-Fan is offline
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Originally Posted by ronaldy27 View Post
How about if you were working in an area that's specific but seen as important for every company like ERM?

I started out working in ERM as an analyst and I never got the traditional actuarial experience that actuaries usually start their careers with like pricing/reserving.
I do get small exposures to different roles in departments from capital modelling but that's it.

What are you guys' thoughts on my case?
Sounds bad.

I had a boss/mentor that preferred EL's start with Valuation. Get to know the data, how important reserving is, get to know the various benefit packages and how their differences affect the data and the future, get some Excel under the belt, etc. Then move on to whatever comes open. He was the Valuation head (and this was Health), so maybe he was biased.

So, starting in ERM might also be something good for exposing an EL to the risks associated with the company. But don't stay there forever. Take your ERM knowledge and incorporate it into a subfield.
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  #14  
Old 06-28-2018, 10:51 AM
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But I love ERM so much
I will get some traditional actuarial knowledge from studying the exams but I know it's not the same as getting actual work experience.

Once I feel like I've learned enough from my current company, I will seek to move to another company.
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Old 06-28-2018, 11:11 AM
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I did interview recently with some large P&C insurers for pricing/reserving roles but I was just not feeling it and I'm not surprised I didn't advanced to the final round.

The interviews were scheduled a week before my exam and I just didn't do a good job faking my enthusiasm for the new roles.

I am worried about being pigeon-holed but I'm very content with my current job.
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Old 06-28-2018, 11:16 AM
Dr T Non-Fan Dr T Non-Fan is offline
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If you're good at it, and you're getting paid well, then don't worry too much about it.

I'd probably try to transfer to openings in-house, to get the experience that other companies (who might pay more) want in candidates.

Something to be said about "easy" workloads (easy both on the brain and time-wise) while studying.
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  #17  
Old 06-28-2018, 11:39 AM
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Originally Posted by ronaldy27 View Post
But I love ERM so much
I will get some traditional actuarial knowledge from studying the exams but I know it's not the same as getting actual work experience.

Once I feel like I've learned enough from my current company, I will seek to move to another company.
you... 'like' ... ERM?

thats some thick cool aid you are drinking.
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Old 06-28-2018, 11:46 AM
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you... 'like' ... ERM?

thats some thick cool aid you are drinking.

okay, not "love" but I do have a strong interest in the subject.

I've personally bought books related to it to read during my time of leisure to expand my knowledge...
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Old 06-28-2018, 12:46 PM
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okay, not "love" but I do have a strong interest in the subject.

I've personally bought books related to it to read during my time of leisure to expand my knowledge...
well, i did just say that everyone should find a role they enjoy.

Ive seen some big life companies have a 'risk management' group that is effectively an ERM department (with the CRO and such). They do a lot of internal audits of actuarial processes/assumptions/methods, so most of the Risk groups ive seen are actuaries. plenty of people make a whole career working in these groups; could be right up your alley. its almost like the academia branch of our actuarial department.
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  #20  
Old 06-28-2018, 06:11 PM
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Running the risk of getting pigeon holed, locked into knowing/doing only one or a few things. Which is fine if this role is all you ever want to do, but how would you know if you've not done anything else? What happens when you want or need to leave the company, or if the company leaves you? Without at least some experience diversification, you've narrowed the field for employment opportunities.
The thing is, I don't observe people getting pigeon-holed because their not rotating, in fact I observe the opposite. I see a lot of people with 20, even 40, employees under them who came on to the team as entry-level 1 or 2. As the years go by, they just absorb more responsibility and even other teams. Even the leader of my 80+ person department started in the same department and has never left.

It seems to me like the reason for this is that their teams are providing results, and the leadership teams respond to this by promoting them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DataDan
Also, working at a company with mandatory rotations, the departments with a lot of rotating students seem to suffer from a perpetual lack of experience- their processes never get updated and the people working them dont have a deep understanding of the methods.
Interesting. I believe that the experience of the people I'm talking about is exactly why they are getting the promotions, as opposed to their wide knowledge of actuarial practice.

Are any of these people pigeon-holed? Maybe. Maybe they can't go get the same level job in some other departments. But they are high up relative to their age as well. If it slows down (in some cases) your upward mobility, that is a significant con to me at the expense of gaining lateral mobility.
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