Actuarial Outpost
 
Go Back   Actuarial Outpost > Cyberchat > Non-Actuarial Topics
FlashChat Actuarial Discussion Preliminary Exams CAS/SOA Exams Cyberchat Around the World Suggestions

DW Simpson
Actuarial Jobs

Visit our site for the most up to date jobs for actuaries.

Actuarial Salary Surveys
Property & Casualty, Health, Life, Pension and Non-Tradtional Jobs.

Actuarial Meeting Schedule
Browse this year's meetings and which recruiters will attend.

Contact DW Simpson
Have a question?
Let's talk.
You'll be glad you did.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #61  
Old 07-05-2018, 12:53 PM
nonlnear nonlnear is offline
Member
Non-Actuary
 
Join Date: May 2010
Favorite beer: Civil Society Fresh IPA
Posts: 29,781
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Colonel Smoothie View Post
Related to transparency is the concept of control. I think a lot of compensation structures don't give a clear picture on what an employee needs to do if they want to earn $X amount, whatever it may be.

This leads to a Kafkaesque struggle for the worker which may lead them to resort to decisions that damage the relationship between employer and employee, including threatening to quit or complaining about salary or quitting outright.

"What do I need to do to earn $X?" That question needs to be clearly answered and honored by the employer if the goals are accomplished. Giving the employees a sense of control results in higher employee motivation and satisfaction, reduced turnover, an increased perception of fairness, and higher productivity.
Threatening to quit is just plain stupid in at least 99% of cases. Quitting outright is good for everyone in a similar proportion of cases.

Companies are not career planning services. Full stop. If you want to make more money, then figure out how you can convince someone you are worth more. And you feeling underpaid in no way implies that you should be getting more money. A boss of mine once told me shortly after giving me an unpaid promotion that "Everyone is underpaid." I quit shortly after, but he was right. He did what he had to do with limited resources in a failing company, but what he said was true even in the bigger sense. Everyone (in salaryland) is underpaid, other than the few who manage to get away with outright fraud. That's the nature of the risk transfer when you go looking for a guaranteed paycheck.
Reply With Quote
  #62  
Old 07-05-2018, 12:55 PM
fdsafdsa's Avatar
fdsafdsa fdsafdsa is offline
Member
SOA
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Posts: 1,301
Default

Funny, I've felt overpaid in every actuarial gig I've had, of course my frame of reference is flipping burgers for slightly over minimum wage, a job which was a lot harder IMO.
__________________
I don't believe there is any real purpose in existence, but I need a temporary sense of purpose in what I'm doing to feel satisfied.
Reply With Quote
  #63  
Old 07-05-2018, 12:59 PM
nonlnear nonlnear is offline
Member
Non-Actuary
 
Join Date: May 2010
Favorite beer: Civil Society Fresh IPA
Posts: 29,781
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by fdsafdsa View Post
Funny, I've felt overpaid in every actuarial gig I've had, of course my frame of reference is flipping burgers for slightly over minimum wage, a job which was a lot harder IMO.
I agree. The difficulty of my work hasn't changed much across very different salary levels. That's not what determines your economic value though. Think replacement cost, not difficulty of work.
Reply With Quote
  #64  
Old 07-05-2018, 01:02 PM
ronaldy27's Avatar
ronaldy27 ronaldy27 is offline
Member
CAS
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: 'Murica
Studying for the credential
Posts: 3,046
Default

I know I'm being paid 10k to 15k below what my friends working in a large city are making, and at first I wanted to make a move to get to their salary level but I noticed I'm making pretty well for someone working in a small city in the south, with lower cost of living, lower state tax, relaxed culture, and not having to deal with 1-hr one way traffic.

With that said, I personally wouldn't want to pry on what others are making and I prefer people to not ask me what I'm making but if they ask, I'd normally just tell them.
__________________
Spoiler - for size:



Reply With Quote
  #65  
Old 07-05-2018, 01:04 PM
Abelian Grape's Avatar
Abelian Grape Abelian Grape is offline
Meme-ber                         Meme-ber
CAS
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 41,426
Default

how much do you make, ronaldy?
Reply With Quote
  #66  
Old 07-05-2018, 01:05 PM
ronaldy27's Avatar
ronaldy27 ronaldy27 is offline
Member
CAS
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: 'Murica
Studying for the credential
Posts: 3,046
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Abelian Grape View Post
how much do you make, ronaldy?
At least $1.
__________________
Spoiler - for size:



Reply With Quote
  #67  
Old 07-05-2018, 01:06 PM
nonlnear nonlnear is offline
Member
Non-Actuary
 
Join Date: May 2010
Favorite beer: Civil Society Fresh IPA
Posts: 29,781
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ronaldy27 View Post
I know I'm being paid 10k to 15k below what my friends working in a large city are making, and at first I wanted to make a move to get to their salary level but I noticed I'm making pretty well for someone working in a small city in the south, with lower cost of living, lower state tax, relaxed culture, and not having to deal with 1-hr one way traffic.

With that said, I personally wouldn't want to pry on what others are making and I prefer people to not ask me what I'm making but if they ask, I'd normally just tell them.
The social stigma around salary discussion has got to be one of the most successful cons that corporate bigwigs have ever foisted on their minions.

How do you feel about house prices being public knowledge? Would you prefer a world where nobody knew what anyone's house cost, and it was considered taboo to try to find out?
Reply With Quote
  #68  
Old 07-05-2018, 01:21 PM
Underpaid Underpaid is offline
Member
SOA
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 525
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by nonlnear View Post
Threatening to quit is just plain stupid in at least 99% of cases. Quitting outright is good for everyone in a similar proportion of cases.

Companies are not career planning services. Full stop. If you want to make more money, then figure out how you can convince someone you are worth more. And you feeling underpaid in no way implies that you should be getting more money. A boss of mine once told me shortly after giving me an unpaid promotion that "Everyone is underpaid." I quit shortly after, but he was right. He did what he had to do with limited resources in a failing company, but what he said was true even in the bigger sense. Everyone (in salaryland) is underpaid, other than the few who manage to get away with outright fraud. That's the nature of the risk transfer when you go looking for a guaranteed paycheck.
hfbb
Reply With Quote
  #69  
Old 07-05-2018, 01:23 PM
Colonel Smoothie's Avatar
Colonel Smoothie Colonel Smoothie is online now
Member
CAS
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
College: Jamba Juice University
Favorite beer: AO Amber Ale
Posts: 47,672
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by nonlnear View Post
Everyone (in salaryland) is underpaid, other than the few who manage to get away with outright fraud. That's the nature of the risk transfer when you go looking for a guaranteed paycheck.
Go on...
__________________
Recommended Readings for the EL Actuary || Recommended Readings for the EB Actuary

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wigmeister General View Post
Don't you even think about sending me your resume. I'll turn it into an origami boulder and return it to you.
Reply With Quote
  #70  
Old 07-05-2018, 01:27 PM
Colonel Smoothie's Avatar
Colonel Smoothie Colonel Smoothie is online now
Member
CAS
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
College: Jamba Juice University
Favorite beer: AO Amber Ale
Posts: 47,672
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Drunken Actuary View Post
lol it doesn't work like that.
Depends on the company. I'd avoid places where the explanation is, "that's the way it works," which isn't very helpful.

But if you want to say something like, "it's too difficult to value what you contribute through your work," that's better. It gives me a clue that I need to take on work where the value I bring is more easily quantified and justifiable.
__________________
Recommended Readings for the EL Actuary || Recommended Readings for the EB Actuary

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wigmeister General View Post
Don't you even think about sending me your resume. I'll turn it into an origami boulder and return it to you.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:34 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
*PLEASE NOTE: Posts are not checked for accuracy, and do not
represent the views of the Actuarial Outpost or its sponsors.
Page generated in 0.27065 seconds with 9 queries