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  #561  
Old 12-15-2006, 09:29 AM
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No $50 player can do a good upconversion of DVD. Your TV will upconvert if your player doesn't, and unless the player does a better job of upconversion than the TV, making the player upconvert will likely make the picture look worse.
do you know when TV's started doing the upconverting? I'm curious because you're saying it as a blanket statement, yet someone might have an older big screen that doesn't upconvert and you could be leading them down the wrong path
One exception is CRT HDTVs. Like CRT computer monitors, they don't have a fixed array of pixels like LCD, Plasma, DLP, etc. so they can display different resolutions without having to up or downconvert.

Even then, 480P on a CRT might still look better than a cheap player's half-assed job of upconverting to 720p or 1080i.

The bottom line: Don't buy a player for its upconversion feature unless (1) the cost difference is negligible compared to another player with the same other features and reputation or (2) you've learned enough about the player to know that it is one of the less than 5% that can do a worthwhile job of upconversion or (3) you're buying it from somewhere with a generous return policy.
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Last edited by Incredible Hulctuary; 12-15-2006 at 10:17 AM..
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  #562  
Old 12-15-2006, 10:15 AM
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The new trend in DVD players today is upconverting DVD players that feed today's modern HDTVs and projectors a high definition image matched to the native resolution of the particular display device (normally 720p or 1080i). Because the upconversion is processed by the player in direct sequence with the MPEG decoding then passed digitally to the display device, the results can be astonishing and far better than can be achieved by using the onboard scalers used by today's HDTVs.
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  #563  
Old 12-15-2006, 10:42 AM
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The new trend in DVD players today is upconverting DVD players that feed today's modern HDTVs and projectors a high definition image matched to the native resolution of the particular display device (normally 720p or 1080i). Because the upconversion is processed by the player in direct sequence with the MPEG decoding then passed digitally to the display device, the results can be astonishing and far better than can be achieved by using the onboard scalers used by today's HDTVs.
Yes, "the results can be astonishing and far better than can be achieved by using the onboard scalers used by today's HDTVs", but over 95% of so-called upconverting DVD players aren't capable of that. The $25 upconverting chip in a $120 player isn't likely to outdo the $100 chip in a $2000 TV.
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Last edited by Incredible Hulctuary; 12-15-2006 at 10:47 AM..
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  #564  
Old 12-15-2006, 11:01 AM
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The new trend in DVD players today is upconverting DVD players that feed today's modern HDTVs and projectors a high definition image matched to the native resolution of the particular display device (normally 720p or 1080i). Because the upconversion is processed by the player in direct sequence with the MPEG decoding then passed digitally to the display device, the results can be astonishing and far better than can be achieved by using the onboard scalers used by today's HDTVs.
Yes, "the results can be astonishing and far better than can be achieved by using the onboard scalers used by today's HDTVs", but over 95% of so-called upconverting DVD players aren't capable of that. The $25 upconverting chip in a $120 player isn't likely to outdo the $100 chip in a $2000 TV.
From what I have read:

DVD + HDTV < Unpconverting DVD + HDTV < HD DVD + HDTV.

Do you have any links to indicate the bolded comments? I feel that you just think the same thing is going on in the TV and in the DVD player without actually having any evidence that would really indicate that.
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  #565  
Old 12-15-2006, 11:13 AM
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sgibson, do you actually use your PS3 to look at pictures and listen to music?

I'm only asking because I don't really see the point of it.
For entertaining purposes, yes. Having my mp3 collection on the PS3 hooked up to my surround sound is easily the best party jukebox experience I've had in my apartment. Easier navigation and better sound than using a Y-connector from my laptop into my receiver. On the pictures, not so much; but reviewing the previous night's festivities on a 37 inch tv can be amusing. And the "picture album" slideshow where it plops your pictures down like they were actual prints/polaroids and documents date/time is simply awesome from a technical standpoint. I think it's more the principle.

It uses the G standard, but from what I hear(big rumor) it has the hardware requirements for the N standard and will have a firmware update to utilize it once finalized.

As for the upconverting DVD player, I was trying to make a point that it seems kind of silly to not include that functionality. I will say the DVDs looked great, but I doubt my Westinghouse has a robust TV scalar for upconverting images to 1080p. I'm sure the cell processor could be put to good use and Sony has all sorts of experience with WEGA technology and in their own DVD players. Why not put that in their "wonderbox"?

They need this thing to succeed for billions of reasons, and so far I don't think they've put in enough effort to make it a worthwhile purchase for the consumer unless they want a Blu-ray player(see below for article about PS3 being "best" blu-ray player currently on market). My hope and instinct thinks it will meet expectations by next X-mas.

http://crave.cnet.com/8301-1_105-966....html?tag=head
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  #566  
Old 12-15-2006, 11:16 AM
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Sidenote...the PS3 is freaking huge and weighs a ton, but it is quieter than my PS2 and dissipates heat very well.
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  #567  
Old 12-15-2006, 11:20 AM
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When I got my PS3, I was told it came with an HDMI cable.
Whoever told you that is an idiot for several reasons. Most notably that he missed a chance to sell you an overpriced HDMI cable.
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  #568  
Old 12-15-2006, 11:28 AM
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When I got my PS3, I was told it came with an HDMI cable.
Whoever told you that is an idiot for several reasons. Most notably that he missed a chance to sell you an overpriced HDMI cable.
Do most (all?) HDDVD/BluRay/Upconverting-HDMI DVD players come with cables?

I don't think PS3 not coming with cables is really Sony's marketing mistake. Sure it coulda come with one, but as long as there's something on the box that makes it clear it's not included (a "what's in the box" section?), then it's up to the floor/salesperson to make that clear.

You go buy a car, the sticker on the window does say "this does not come with...", but instead tells you what it DOES come with. The salesperson is supposed to tell you what your missing out on and has the responsibility of the sale. (situations aren't COMPLETELY similar, as you can't really buy a new car w/o a salesperson, but you CAN buy a PS3 without saying a word to anyone).

This was an issue with printers in the 90's. They all used to come with a cable, but sometime in the mid/late 90's they stopped including them. It was left up to the salesperson to let ppl know they would have to buy a cable (and proceed to point them to the $30 gold-plated - useless cables). Nowadays, most somewhat-tech-savvy people come to expect when they buy a printer that they need to buy a cable as well.
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  #569  
Old 12-15-2006, 11:37 AM
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Yes, "the results can be astonishing and far better than can be achieved by using the onboard scalers used by today's HDTVs", but over 95% of so-called upconverting DVD players aren't capable of that. The $25 upconverting chip in a $120 player isn't likely to outdo the $100 chip in a $2000 TV.
From what I have read:

DVD + HDTV < Unpconverting DVD + HDTV < HD DVD + HDTV.

Do you have any links to indicate the bolded comments? I feel that you just think the same thing is going on in the TV and in the DVD player without actually having any evidence that would really indicate that.
Google around for upconverting DVD quality and reviews you'll find some links. Browse around places like avsforum.com and you'll see that only a few players will get good comments about upconversion, like the Oppo and some of the expensive Denons.

Upconverting typically involves post-processing of the decoded stream rather than upconversion embedded in the decoding process, so effectively they are just doing the same thing the TV would do. Commingling decoding with upconversion can theoretically produce a better picture, but it is more complex and expensive to do that (which some of the $1000+ players probably do).

As a concrete example, my upconverting DVD player is worse at it than my TV. It was thrown in for free (retailed for about $150) with the TV, and I would not have chosen to buy it myself.

Upconverting involves inventing pixels that aren't there on the disc. As a result, pixels can be introduced that degrade the quality rather than make it better. Some upconverting players make the picture worse, some make no noticeable difference, some make it look better. The latter is a minority and ain't cheap.

Anyway, you don't have to care about what I'm saying. It's your money you'll be wasting if you buy an upconverting player that doesn't do a good job of it.
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Last edited by Incredible Hulctuary; 12-15-2006 at 11:44 AM..
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  #570  
Old 12-15-2006, 11:44 AM
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http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16222369/

Also, according to this link, you have to upgrade the measly .024 inch diameter wrist strap to a "BEEFED UP" .04 inch wrist strap.

Mmmm...Beefy

I swear this article was taken from The Onion
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