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  #31  
Old 06-12-2018, 05:42 PM
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what? care to provide data, I realize toyota is the most dependable statistically but again the difference is immaterial IMO from the data I have seen. Most modern cars are very reliable. I agree about the depreciation but if your keeping it longer than its immaterial and the smart thing to do is get 20% off msrp of a so called new clunker and hold it for at least 10 years. You can also apply this to stocks.
KBB 5 year cost to own, base model 2018:

Buick LaCrosse (one of the better american sedans)
Cash price $29,270
1-year depreciation $13,111
5-year depreciation $21,953

Toyota Avalon (similarly sorta-premium)
Cash price $30,145
1-year depreciation $12,265
5-year depreciation $19,830

Chevy Impala (not quite as premium, similar depreciation)
Cash price $26,954
1-year depreciation $12,857
5-year depreciation $19,187

Ford Taurus (still lower residual ratios)
Cash price $26,185
1-year depreciation $13,150
5-year depreciation $20,552

All very comparable cars. Toyota has the highest price and lowest depreciation, here.

Also MSRP is a made-up number. Please don't be fooled into thinking you are getting a deal.
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  #32  
Old 06-13-2018, 01:01 AM
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i found a demo model GMC Canyon. Bought it, did not lease. Even the sales guy never leased. List price was 41,900. I went in with a price, $33.500 (goal was ~ 20% off MSRP) Got it for $34,900. I got stuff I wanted, Leather seats, crew cab, short bed, 20" shoes, Black/Black, LineX, . Didn't need the NAV (ya know, cell phone) but it is pretty nice to have the Apple Apps and I see my phone on the screen in the truck. On Star is free too. I'm happy with the purchase. Didn't like the experience, but thats car buying. Free Oil Changes for 2 years, free car washes whenever, dealer is pretty much across the street from work and when its in the shop my dealer will take me back and forth.

I negotiated if there is a larger "rebate" than what I got then I'd get a refund. Expires in 60 days.

Im going to get some Nerf bars and tint the front windows. Also a tent for the back end.
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Beer is ****ing amazing

Last edited by T-roy; 06-13-2018 at 01:08 AM..
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  #33  
Old 06-13-2018, 08:50 AM
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Quick search found this list: maintenance cost over first ten years of ownership.

https://twocents.lifehacker.com/the-...ver-1781639773

Still would need 10-year depreciation amounts to get total cost.

This has top 20 least and most expensive to maintain cars by model.

https://www.yourmechanic.com/article...y-maddy-martin
great so those are 10 year old cars, which does not reflect the improvement and homogenization of the industry over the last few years. It also does not shown the frequency of failure probability for a given car. It does not show that the depreciation is in the sticker price.

Now I just looked up my data (used car auctions) and compared a chevy midsize mali vs a camry from around the years 1997-2015 with mileage between 120K and 140K. The data set size is 40K cars for camry and around 20K cars for malibus. The powertrain failure rate for camry is 11% and 17% for malibu.

on top of that who cares. if you buy new you get 5 year warranty, roadside stuff and what not. As long as you get it off the sticker to pay your depreciation after warranty is over.
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  #34  
Old 06-13-2018, 08:56 AM
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Originally Posted by T-roy View Post
i found a demo model GMC Canyon. Bought it, did not lease. Even the sales guy never leased. List price was 41,900. I went in with a price, $33.500 (goal was ~ 20% off MSRP) Got it for $34,900. I got stuff I wanted, Leather seats, crew cab, short bed, 20" shoes, Black/Black, LineX, . Didn't need the NAV (ya know, cell phone) but it is pretty nice to have the Apple Apps and I see my phone on the screen in the truck. On Star is free too. I'm happy with the purchase. Didn't like the experience, but thats car buying. Free Oil Changes for 2 years, free car washes whenever, dealer is pretty much across the street from work and when its in the shop my dealer will take me back and forth.

I negotiated if there is a larger "rebate" than what I got then I'd get a refund. Expires in 60 days.

Im going to get some Nerf bars and tint the front windows. Also a tent for the back end.
congrats! sounds like you got the Denali trim very nice.
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  #35  
Old 06-13-2018, 09:53 AM
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Oh you wanted a truck. That's a different ballgame. American manufacturers have a leg up, there. Build quality tends to be a bit better vs. sedans, just more investment in them from Ford, GM et al.

I had nightmares you were going to lease a Ford Fusion or something silly (like my parents did, and the transmission went out within 10k miles, murica)
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  #36  
Old 06-13-2018, 10:00 AM
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congrats! sounds like you got the Denali trim very nice.
No! Limited. The Denali was $5K more and it had a 6' box. I don't like that style. The Toyota Tacoma's were all 6' boxes, hense why I went to GMC.
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  #37  
Old 06-13-2018, 10:03 AM
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Oh you wanted a truck. That's a different ballgame. American manufacturers have a leg up, there. Build quality tends to be a bit better vs. sedans, just more investment in them from Ford, GM et al.

I had nightmares you were going to lease a Ford Fusion or something silly (like my parents did, and the transmission went out within 10k miles, murica)
Well, I had two thoughts really. Just get a throw away car/very inexpensive lease for 2 years, or get what I really wanted (Have been looking at the Tacomas for 2 months). If there was a good lease program (like $200 a month, $0 down) for a Ford Fusion I would have don't it. Its two years. Big deal.

I am happy I got the truck.
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  #38  
Old 06-13-2018, 10:03 AM
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But still I'm drivin' a truck
Drivin' a big ol' truck
Headin' down the interstate just trying to make a buck
Wearin' feather boas with sequins and chiffons
Driving a truck with my high heels on
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  #39  
Old 06-13-2018, 10:27 AM
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MM, is this your first pickup? i got a toyota pickup many years ago on a 2 year lease because it was really cheap, didn't currently have cash, didn't want debt, etc. the truck was so handy that i haven't been without one since. probably doesn't make as much sense for apt or condo owners, but it's great for single fam detached home owners
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  #40  
Old 06-13-2018, 10:34 AM
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Originally Posted by mathmajor View Post
Oh you wanted a truck. That's a different ballgame. American manufacturers have a leg up, there. Build quality tends to be a bit better vs. sedans, just more investment in them from Ford, GM et al.

I had nightmares you were going to lease a Ford Fusion or something silly (like my parents did, and the transmission went out within 10k miles, murica)
well thats not really true. Lots of investment mean "new" stuff like more efficient engines and trannys and better ride and handling. Toyotas Tacoma/Tundra blow anything out the water in terms of reliability.

reason why is toyota are using an engine from 2007 in the Tundra, its multiport thus lower fuel milage, engine 3UR-FE V8 very reliable/bulletproof. The trans has 6 gears.
Now go to f-150 constantly updating engines with new turbos in a V6, tweaking the 5.0 V8 coyote now has a duel DI and multiport . Silverado OHC V8 now has Direct injection plus active fuel management. Trans now have up to 10 gears.
Now do you want better fuel economy, performance, handling or do you want reliability? Now that reliability could be a 6% change of fewer problems in 10 years or more.

the same applies to cars toyota tends to keep changes very small. Its not magic. I do agree with build quality investment in the factories, trucks actually turn a profit.
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