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  #11  
Old 08-27-2014, 02:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Arthur Kade View Post
I am not CAS, but as a former SOA grader, let me assure that when you're finished grading you'll wish you had paid your own flight and hotel.

Think about it this way, if the CAS had to pay you to do it, how much would you demand? You'd probably demand more than a flight to Vegas and a couple of hotel nights cost.
You could have suffered a little more and gone up the ranks; you get to know about SOA politics a lot that way; it is quite different from what you see in here. Your lost!
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  #12  
Old 08-27-2014, 02:43 PM
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I'm not sure how much work it entails (although from the other comments, it sounds like a lot). If it's a utilization of my spare time after exam season then I'd be willing to grade at $15/hour.
$15 a hour for an experienced FCAS performing mentally grueling labor? I know the CAS is a volunteer organization but I can't bring myself to forego family time, as well as employer time to be a grader. A free trip to vegas, is what $1500?

Pay the graders IMO.

edit: just realized I sound a lot like the college athletes!
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  #13  
Old 08-27-2014, 03:18 PM
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$15 a hour for an experienced FCAS performing mentally grueling labor? I know the CAS is a volunteer organization but I can't bring myself to forego family time, as well as employer time to be a grader. A free trip to vegas, is what $1500?

Pay the graders IMO.

edit: just realized I sound a lot like the college athletes!
Mentally grueling? Aren't you just supposed to fail everybody to make yourself relatively more valuable?
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  #14  
Old 08-27-2014, 03:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Arthur Kade View Post
...Think about it this way, if the CAS had to pay you to do it, how much would you demand? You'd probably demand more than a flight to Vegas and a couple of hotel nights cost.
This is VERY true. It's a lot of time preparing for the trip, and most of the actual trip is spent in meetings. I guess you get "free" airfare even if you extend your stay. Whoo Hoo! The people who volunteer mostly do it because they care about the process.
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Old 08-27-2014, 03:26 PM
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Originally Posted by NAMAK View Post
$15 a hour for an experienced FCAS performing mentally grueling labor? I know the CAS is a volunteer organization but I can't bring myself to forego family time, as well as employer time to be a grader. A free trip to vegas, is what $1500?

Pay the graders IMO.

edit: just realized I sound a lot like the college athletes!
Paying graders would reduce the pool of eligible graders. I think you'd pretty much have to hire a consulting firm, and there would be conflict-of-interest issues with that.

While the bulk of the work is done evenings and weekends in preparation for the meeting, most companies allow their actuaries to volunteer (so the companies are volunteering, too) and the time you spend in Vegas and in other meetings that happen during the work day, and the time you spend booking your flight, and the photocopies you make, or whatever, are donated by your employer. I don't think employers would support that if you were moonlighting rather than volunteering.
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  #16  
Old 08-27-2014, 03:47 PM
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I heard CFA exam graders get paid, there is a long wait list for the graders and they gather in a really bad location... I suppose E&E volunteer army is a tradition in actuarial.
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  #17  
Old 08-27-2014, 04:15 PM
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Originally Posted by BruteForce View Post
Does the SOA make you pay for your own flight/hotel?
No, they don't.

But they move around the location for central grading.


And yes, on the SOA side, you spend far more time grading at home than you do on location, primarily because fewer papers are checked at central grading than initial grading.
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  #18  
Old 08-27-2014, 04:16 PM
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I heard CFA exam graders get paid, there is a long wait list for the graders and they gather in a really bad location... I suppose E&E volunteer army is a tradition in actuarial.
I heard that most of the grading of CFA exams can be done by computers.
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  #19  
Old 08-27-2014, 05:25 PM
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Paying graders would reduce the pool of eligible graders. I think you'd pretty much have to hire a consulting firm, and there would be conflict-of-interest issues with that.
While the bulk of the work is done evenings and weekends in preparation for the meeting, most companies allow their actuaries to volunteer (so the companies are volunteering, too) and the time you spend in Vegas and in other meetings that happen during the work day, and the time you spend booking your flight, and the photocopies you make, or whatever, are donated by your employer. I don't think employers would support that if you were moonlighting rather than volunteering.
please explain the conflict of issues with the proposed system that aren't there with the current system?

If anything, hiring a consulting firm will improve the accuracy of the product. Has anyone done a cost benefit analysis vs. hiring a team of 5 consultants/FCAS to do all the grading and paying them for it vs. flying an army of volunteers out to Vegas? I believe the grading would be improved with paid employees. There is some truth to the saying "you get what you pay for."

Last edited by NAMAK; 08-27-2014 at 05:37 PM..
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  #20  
Old 08-27-2014, 05:58 PM
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You don't see a difference between 200 people dispersed among 80 companies and 35 people who all work for the same firm, which also has students?

I recognize the handwriting of most of the people I work with daily. If I am grading an exam and happen to see one question that looks like Joe wrote it, I will do my best to be objective. But it's only one question, and odds are there wasn't a lot of room for judgement. If I have an unconscious bias, it's very unlikely to matter more than a quarter point. If I am grading Joe's whole exam, it's a completely different story.
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