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View Poll Results: Will self driving autos kill car insurance?
Of course 37 16.52%
Maybe but not for a long time 162 72.32%
I'm a luddite... 25 11.16%
Voters: 224. You may not vote on this poll

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  #1641  
Old 09-13-2017, 06:14 PM
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Sredni Vashtar Sredni Vashtar is online now
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Originally Posted by twig93 View Post
I assume that Tesla is found partially responsible because their technology did not work as well as they implied it did, or something along those lines.
Nope. They were up front about the limitations, and the driver ignored repeated warnings.

They think Tesla is at fault for being unable to ensure driver attention, monitoring driver engagement, and ensuring it is used on certain roads.
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Last edited by Sredni Vashtar; 09-13-2017 at 06:34 PM..
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  #1642  
Old 09-13-2017, 10:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Sredni Vashtar View Post
Nope. They were up front about the limitations, and the driver ignored repeated warnings.

They think Tesla is at fault for being unable to ensure driver attention, monitoring driver engagement, and ensuring it is used on certain roads.
OK, that's sort of in line with what I was thinking... certainly not for "being more dangerous than a motorcycle" at any rate.
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  #1643  
Old 09-14-2017, 11:42 AM
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Originally Posted by twig93 View Post
OK, that's sort of in line with what I was thinking... certainly not for "being more dangerous than a motorcycle" at any rate.
They'll tell Tesla that they HAVE to do something to make sure the driver is paying attention, but they sure as hell aren't going to tell Harley that they need to invent a device that makes sure the rider is sober, wearing a helmet, driving at safe speeds, taking safe turns, driving on appropriate roads, etc. etc. etc.

Whatever they do will result in at least some increase in price in the safest vehicle on the market, which will result in more people choosing less safe vehicles.
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Last edited by Sredni Vashtar; 09-14-2017 at 11:47 AM..
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  #1644  
Old 09-14-2017, 11:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sredni Vashtar View Post
They'll tell Tesla that they HAVE to do something to make sure the driver is paying attention, but they sure as hell aren't going to tell Harley that they need to invent a device that makes sure the rider is sober, wearing a helmet, driving at safe speeds, taking safe turns, driving on appropriate roads, etc. etc. etc.

Whatever they do will result in at least some increase in price in the safest vehicle on the market, which will result in more people choosing less safe vehicles.
Are drunk drivers restricted to Harley Davidsons or something?

I don't know if Tesla is actually the safest car on the market while in auto-drive mode, but even if that claim is correct... if you're honestly surprised that the government is holding self-driving cars to a higher standard than self-driven ones, all I can say is "told you so". I predicted this scores of pages back, and I'll reiterate:

Technology is going to be expected to perform to a substantially higher standard than humans. Tesla-at-fault accidents (or Tesla-partially-at-fault accidents) will be judged far more harshly than driver-at-fault accidents. If Tesla isn't the manufacturer, then substitute in whoever is.
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  #1645  
Old 09-14-2017, 12:00 PM
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Originally Posted by twig93 View Post
all I can say is "told you so".
Yeah, I saw it coming too. I just hoped it would take a more honest form.

eg. "we're going to require a much better crash record than other vehicles."

Not "we'll punish you if a driver is even capable of being an idiot"
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  #1646  
Old 09-14-2017, 01:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twig93 View Post
Are drunk drivers restricted to Harley Davidsons or something?

I don't know if Tesla is actually the safest car on the market while in auto-drive mode, but even if that claim is correct... if you're honestly surprised that the government is holding self-driving cars to a higher standard than self-driven ones, all I can say is "told you so". I predicted this scores of pages back, and I'll reiterate:

Technology is going to be expected to perform to a substantially higher standard than humans. Tesla-at-fault accidents (or Tesla-partially-at-fault accidents) will be judged far more harshly than driver-at-fault accidents. If Tesla isn't the manufacturer, then substitute in whoever is.
If you think you are a significantly safer driver than the average person, it is only rational to not want to relinquish control. I would guess 90% of drivers believe this.
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  #1647  
Old 09-14-2017, 01:46 PM
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Originally Posted by echo View Post
If you think you are a significantly safer driver than the average person, it is only rational to not want to relinquish control. I would guess 90% of drivers believe this.
Not sure I buy this logic. The better the driver I am compared to the average person, the more I want EVERYONE to give up control.
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  #1648  
Old 09-14-2017, 02:48 PM
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Originally Posted by glassy View Post
Not sure I buy this logic. The better the driver I am compared to the average person, the more I want EVERYONE to give up control.
Yeah, I guess one can make arguments either way.

Vaccines provide a significant public benefit with very low risks. There are decades of experience supporting their benefits. Seems like it would be a slam dunk to require everyone to be vaccinated. Hasn't happened. Then there's the anti-vaxers that have sprung up in the last 10 years or so.

I think it will be more difficult to require self driving autos than to require vaccination. The benefits are smaller. JMO.
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  #1649  
Old 09-14-2017, 05:39 PM
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i disagree with the NTSB faulting Tesla.

one idiot misused the product out of how many thousands?

it's kinda like faulting McDonald's because one dude got obese eating mcd's twelve times a day
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  #1650  
Old 09-14-2017, 06:02 PM
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I got the impression that it was less them faulting Tesla as it was identifying areas that could have prevented the fatality. i.e.
1. The truck shouldn't have turned left unsafely.
2. The Tesla driver shouldn't have been an irresponsible a**.
3. Tesla shouldn't have allowed autopilot to continue operating, given #2.
4. Tesla shouldn't have allowed autopilot to engage on types of roads it isn't qualified/approved on.
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