Actuarial Outpost
 
Go Back   Actuarial Outpost > Actuarial Discussion Forum > Careers - Employment
FlashChat Actuarial Discussion Preliminary Exams CAS/SOA Exams Cyberchat Around the World Suggestions

Actuarial Jobs by State

New York  New Jersey  Connecticut  Massachusetts 
California  Florida  Texas  Illinois  Colorado


View Poll Results: Mediocre FCAS/FSA Vs. Hardworking ACAS/ASA?
Insurance, FCAS/FSA 12 25.53%
Insurance, ACAS/ASA 23 48.94%
Consulting, FCAS/FSA 8 17.02%
Consulting, ACAS/ASA 18 38.30%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 47. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #11  
Old 01-10-2019, 05:13 PM
Childish Gambino's Avatar
Childish Gambino Childish Gambino is offline
Member
SOA
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 28,276
Default

Poll options are confusing.

How do I know which one is hardworking? Did the FSA tell me in the interview that he's a loafer?
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert S. Mueller III
The conclusion that Congress may apply the obstruction laws to the President's corrupt exercise of the powers of office accords with our constitutional system of checks and balances and the principle that no person is above the law.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 01-10-2019, 05:20 PM
The_Polymath's Avatar
The_Polymath The_Polymath is offline
Member
CAS SOA
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 1,601
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CowboyGuy View Post
Do you really think a hard working ACAS/ASA can't develop a skill that a mediocre FCAS/FSA can?
Depends.

Has the ASA been working for longer/less than the Fellow?

In my own experiences when dealing with fellows/associates, it becomes pretty obvious quickly who is actually competent at X (I am assuming you need this person to do X a lot)

Seen many fellows who zoomed through the exams, and where incompetent in many areas because of this. Thats not to say that they couldn't improve in those areas, but their salary was simply not reflective of their ability to add value to our bottom line. In this case, I would hire an associate with skill in X anyday over a Fellow who did not
__________________
Quote:
Consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 01-10-2019, 05:24 PM
CowboyGuy CowboyGuy is offline
Member
SOA
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 2,295
Default

In consulting, they can often charge more for FCAS/FSA (as a proportion of the cost), and also its more important for a consulting company that their actuaries bill hours (compared to insurance companies), and hence the distinction in the poll.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 01-10-2019, 05:27 PM
CowboyGuy CowboyGuy is offline
Member
SOA
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 2,295
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Childish Gambino View Post
Poll options are confusing.

How do I know which one is hardworking? Did the FSA tell me in the interview that he's a loafer?
Hiring can be from another team as well, you can easily know how hard working a person is by talking to their manager.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 01-10-2019, 05:44 PM
The_Polymath's Avatar
The_Polymath The_Polymath is offline
Member
CAS SOA
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 1,601
Smile

Quote:
Originally Posted by CowboyGuy View Post
In consulting, they can often charge more for FCAS/FSA (as a proportion of the cost), and also its more important for a consulting company that their actuaries bill hours (compared to insurance companies), and hence the distinction in the poll.
Slight problem here.

Yes, your bill rate would be higher, but because the fellow added such little value, the company ultimately decided to not consider your consultancy the next time they ran into resourcing issues, and needed some expert advice.

Classic penny wise, pound foolish mistake that many consultancies make.

Simply having a bum on the seat charging high rates achieves little, if you truly want a close long-term (and profitable) relationship with a client. Quality of work product matters.
__________________
Quote:
Consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 01-10-2019, 07:35 PM
DataDan's Avatar
DataDan DataDan is offline
Member
SOA
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: East Coast US
Posts: 3,331
Default

I dont make these calls, but at my company you are FSA or GTFO.

We spell actuary with an F here. career ASA are effectively treated as inferior beings that couldnt even pass a few more exams.

Im an ASA and I realize that if I want to move up I can either get FSA or leave the company.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 01-10-2019, 07:37 PM
DataDan's Avatar
DataDan DataDan is offline
Member
SOA
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: East Coast US
Posts: 3,331
Default

totally different experience in consulting btw. ASA could be fairly high level. more emphasis on how good of a consulting actuary you are.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 01-11-2019, 07:58 AM
nonlnear nonlnear is offline
Member
Non-Actuary
 
Join Date: May 2010
Favorite beer: Civil Society Fresh IPA
Posts: 30,633
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CowboyGuy View Post
As a hiring manager, would you prefer to hire a mediocre FCAS/FSA or a hardworking ACAS/ASA?
Working hard is often a crutch for mediocrity. Is the hard working A* mediocre or actually good?
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 01-11-2019, 08:21 AM
Transitive Tangerine's Avatar
Transitive Tangerine Transitive Tangerine is offline
Member
COPA
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Studying for FAP (hehehe nice)
Posts: 1,225
Default

when did the cas actuaries get their credentials? because there's an obvious difference in caliber between actuaries who passed multiple choice exams and the ones who made it through the IQ era.

[white][/white]
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 01-11-2019, 08:38 AM
MathinTucson's Avatar
MathinTucson MathinTucson is offline
Member
AAA
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: West
Posts: 4,884
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcie View Post
The one who knows the difference between 'who' and 'whom'.
I opened this thread to see if anyone would correct that, and your correction is quite witty!
__________________
"We must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the military–industrial complex." – President Eisenhower
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:46 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
*PLEASE NOTE: Posts are not checked for accuracy, and do not
represent the views of the Actuarial Outpost or its sponsors.
Page generated in 0.20593 seconds with 10 queries