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  #621  
Old 04-03-2018, 12:52 PM
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Pujols4Prez Pujols4Prez is offline
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my team is properly rated today! Go Cats!

Me and gosu are gonna party like its 1985!
Congrats. Two titles in three years is pretty impressive.
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  #622  
Old 04-03-2018, 12:59 PM
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Not counting play in wins because that just gets you into the field of 64. You should check again. ACC had 9 teams get in so they have 9 losses.
I meant 12-9... so if Syracuse had lost would you have counted that? :P. It's still a tournament win whether you like it or not. Do we count Kansas St. beating UMBC as a win?
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  #623  
Old 04-03-2018, 01:07 PM
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Play-in games are different from regular games; it's OK to count them separately.
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  #624  
Old 04-03-2018, 02:17 PM
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I meant 12-9... so if Syracuse had lost would you have counted that? :P. It's still a tournament win whether you like it or not. Do we count Kansas St. beating UMBC as a win?
If they lost I would not. PAC 12 was 0-1. They only had one team make the tournament. The only other way to count play-in games as a result is to then give all of the other 60 teams an extra win.

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Play-in games are different from regular games; it's OK to count them separately.
This.
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  #625  
Old 04-03-2018, 02:32 PM
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If they lost I would not. PAC 12 was 0-1. They only had one team make the tournament. The only other way to count play-in games as a result is to then give all of the other 60 teams an extra win.



This.
So you count Kansas beating the sisters of the poor but you dot count Syracuse beating a team that was ranked similarly to them.

So if Syracuse had lost in the play-in game that wouldn't be a mark against the ACC but if they won that game and then lost to the 6 seed then that counts as a poor performance?

It's almost as if this metric of "record in the NCAA tournament" is stupid.
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  #626  
Old 04-03-2018, 02:39 PM
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So you count Kansas beating the sisters of the poor but you dot count Syracuse beating a team that was ranked similarly to them.

So if Syracuse had lost in the play-in game that wouldn't be a mark against the ACC but if they won that game and then lost to the 6 seed then that counts as a poor performance?

It's almost as if this metric of "record in the NCAA tournament" is stupid.
I don't put regular season games, conference tournament wins, or play-in wins in the same category as NCAA Tournament wins.

From my perspective play-in games are just that, games that give you the opportunity to make it into the 64-team bracket.
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  #627  
Old 04-03-2018, 02:42 PM
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So you count Kansas beating the sisters of the poor but you dot count Syracuse beating a team that was ranked similarly to them.

So if Syracuse had lost in the play-in game that wouldn't be a mark against the ACC but if they won that game and then lost to the 6 seed then that counts as a poor performance?

It's almost as if this metric of "record in the NCAA tournament" is stupid.
Yeah, I don't count that, because Syracuse had to win that game JUST to make the field of 64. That metric has its flaws just like every metric. I don't even think comparing conferences is that useful of an exercise because there are so many variables. I just don't see what causes people to say the Big XII is overrated this year compared to any other conference. I even heard a color guy on an ACC game this year (apparently he played at Virginia) say that the Big XII was nice and all, but what Trae Young was doing wasn't impressive because the competition was poor. He then doubled down to say Marvin Bagley would average 50 points a game if he was in the Big XII. He was obviously nuts, but that seems to be the sentiment, but I don't see metrics that back it up.
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  #628  
Old 04-03-2018, 03:31 PM
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Yeah, I don't count that, because Syracuse had to win that game JUST to make the field of 64. That metric has its flaws just like every metric. I don't even think comparing conferences is that useful of an exercise because there are so many variables. I just don't see what causes people to say the Big XII is overrated this year compared to any other conference. I even heard a color guy on an ACC game this year (apparently he played at Virginia) say that the Big XII was nice and all, but what Trae Young was doing wasn't impressive because the competition was poor. He then doubled down to say Marvin Bagley would average 50 points a game if he was in the Big XII. He was obviously nuts, but that seems to be the sentiment, but I don't see metrics that back it up.
That metric has way more flaws than most metrics.

The Big 12 is a great conference, no doubt. Mostly I say that because it has only 10 teams and usually 8 or 9 of them are pretty good. That means that there are very few nights off.

This doesn't mean the top teams are any better than the top teams in other conferences. Kansas/WV/Texas Tech certainly aren't any better than UVA/Duke/UNC or Mich St./Purdue/Michigan. The ACC and B10 just have more teams at the bottom.

Do you rate a conference based on their top teams or their bottom teams? I'd say we generally care a lot more about the top teams.
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  #629  
Old 04-03-2018, 03:55 PM
DanielSong39 DanielSong39 is offline
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This is roughly how I rate conferences:

- Championships
- Final Fours
- Combined Tournament wins (usually 10+ is very good)
- Number of teams to make the Tournament

Usually the metric for a dominant conference in a particular season is:
- Win Championship (this is a must)
- 2+ teams in Final Four
- 15+ wins
- 5+ teams (Half the teams if conference has 9 teams or fewer)

Conferences to meet all these metrics:
1985 Big East
1989 Big Ten
2000 Big Ten

Curiously this has never been done by the ACC.
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