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  #1  
Old 09-13-2019, 04:20 PM
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Jasper07734 Jasper07734 is online now
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Default Dan Lok

Great idiot, or greatest idiot?

Jaspess has been reading and watching videos about financial stuff, since she never really learned any of it before. For a while she has been enthralled by this Dan Lok person (whom I had never heard of before) and was considering learning more about one of his whatevers that he offers.

The more I read about him though, the more snake-oil-salesman vibe I got from him.

On a scale from Robert Kiyosaki to Warren Buffett, how bad is he? And are there any pop financial people worth listening to?
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Old 09-16-2019, 10:05 AM
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Looking into Lok, he seems kind of image obsessed, which I don't much care for. Like he's trying to convince you that he's a mega-success so you'll buy what he's selling. Lots of people do this. Donald Trump is a great example.

But if she's never learned anything about finances before, then these types of pop finance people are probably fine. I have no familiarity with Dan Lok outside of what I just googled for after reading your OP, but my intro to this stuff was Suze Orman. Everyone's gotta start somewhere. Hopefully she moves on to someone more substantive though.
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Originally Posted by The_Polymath View Post
Armchair internet economists are the worst.
President Trump is a white supremacist.

Spoiler:
We've been over this many times, but since some people like to pretend we haven't, I'm using my sig as a place to list the fairly obvious examples of treating whites as superior to others.

Now, when lazy and disingenuous people try to claim ignorance, I'm 100% entitled to dismissing them as lazy or disingenuous. Hope it helps!

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Old 09-16-2019, 10:25 AM
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As to whether or not pop finance people are worth listening to, I guess that depends. If you're looking for a little motivation, someone like Kiyosaki, Tony Robbins, or Trump is just fine. But there is no one guru who can teach you everything.

When I was like, 17, I read Suze Orman's book. That got me going on saving and building credit. Then at 18 or 19, I read Kiyosaki. That got me excited about being independently wealthy. At 20, I read David Crook to get more of the nuts and bolts of income producing assets. In my mid 20s, once I had money, I started talking with people who actually bought and leased real-estate. So on and so on.

So all of these "gurus" were important to me in some way.

But there are also a lot of people who start with Tony Robbins and stay with Tony Robbins long after he's saying anything of substance. That's how you end up spending $10K on "2020: Vision for the New You" seminars.

I think it's strange to include Warren Buffet on the list of pop finance gurus though. Buffett legitimately made his money doing what he's purported to do - not selling "secrets". Any books he's "written" are just compilations of letters and essays.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Polymath View Post
Armchair internet economists are the worst.
President Trump is a white supremacist.

Spoiler:
We've been over this many times, but since some people like to pretend we haven't, I'm using my sig as a place to list the fairly obvious examples of treating whites as superior to others.

Now, when lazy and disingenuous people try to claim ignorance, I'm 100% entitled to dismissing them as lazy or disingenuous. Hope it helps!

The short list
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  #4  
Old 09-16-2019, 11:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redprinceton View Post
I think it's strange to include Warren Buffet on the list of pop finance gurus though. Buffett legitimately made his money doing what he's purported to do - not selling "secrets". Any books he's "written" are just compilations of letters and essays.
Yeah, I just put him there as the "good" end of a bad to good scale of financial folks. (I associate Kiyosaki with "bad" after reading about his advice to buy physical metals (silver in particular) as opposed to, say, shares in metal ETFs.)
__________________
I'm not a bad Jasp! I'm just misunderstood.

The revAOlution will be complete when the language is perfect.

Quote:
Originally Posted by William F. Buckley, Jr.
Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views.
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  #5  
Old 09-16-2019, 11:40 AM
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The thing that rang alarm bells for me was when Jaspess signed up for a call from one of his class thingies that he offers.

I think it would be better for us to start by consulting with a certified financial planner. Are those expensive though? Or are initial consultations free? Or...? (I've never really been organized with money before, and Jaspess being, a bit younger than I am, is just starting out thinking about this stuff.)
__________________
I'm not a bad Jasp! I'm just misunderstood.

The revAOlution will be complete when the language is perfect.

Quote:
Originally Posted by William F. Buckley, Jr.
Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 09-16-2019, 12:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasper07734 View Post
Yeah, I just put him there as the "good" end of a bad to good scale of financial folks. (I associate Kiyosaki with "bad" after reading about his advice to buy physical metals (silver in particular) as opposed to, say, shares in metal ETFs.)
Gotcha. I wouldn't consider Kiyosaki "bad" because he offers up commodities in a different way than I would though. Even if he's making a back-end commission on it.

But I get it though. I used to have problems with Dave Ramsey for the similar reasons. But the crux of both Ramsey and Kiyosaki, is that you should focus on buying things of "real" value rather than status symbols, which is admirable enough. If someone goes from spending 110% of their income to spending 90% and saving 10%, that's probably a net win. Even if they're ceding some of the earnings on that 10% to the Kiyosaki Investor Network when they really don't have to.

These guys are at their best when they're offering free (or cheap book) advice on broad strokes personal finance. The waters get a bit muddier when they're using you to try to get AUM. They're at their worst when they're straight up selling the "secrets to success" or god forbid, getting out of debt, for large sums of money.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasper07734 View Post
The thing that rang alarm bells for me was when Jaspess signed up for a call from one of his class thingies that he offers.

I think it would be better for us to start by consulting with a certified financial planner. Are those expensive though? Or are initial consultations free? Or...? (I've never really been organized with money before, and Jaspess being, a bit younger than I am, is just starting out thinking about this stuff.)
Hmm. Tough spot. Of course, treating your wife with respect supersedes financial concerns, even if you think she's exploring something potentially insidious. I would wait-and-see here. If she's interested in the seminar because this Tok guy speaks to her on some level and gets her excited about planning for success, maybe that's a good thing. You don't want to be the guy raining on that parade. Spending money on infotainment and inspiration is perfectly okay in small amounts. If serious money starts getting thrown around, then it's worth a major conversation. But that's a conversation y'all are hopefully going to have anyway.

You have a needle to thread here: Express your concerns, but stand by and support your wife. If she wants to spend a nominal amount of money going down the Dan Lok rabbit hole, encourage her. If, as you suspect, it turns out to be a bust, don't hold it over her. It's a good exercise for partners to explore and find their own answers rather than appealing to the authority of the other person all the time.

As for whether you should seek out a CFP, I think that largely depends upon how much money you have and how close to retirement you are. If you're mid-career, I would keep plugging away with standard advice: contribute as much as you can to tax advantaged accounts and invest in broad, low cost index funds. If your situation is more complex, you have a lot of assets, or if you're close to retirement and just want someone to hold your hand so you don't fudge something up with taxes, then maybe a CFP could be useful. Obligatory "look for a fiduciary so you don't end up with a glorified salesman who farms all your assets out to his pricey investment manager buddies" advice applies here.

Best of luck!

Obligatory disclosures: IANAFP. I'm just a personal finance geek in his early 30s.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Polymath View Post
Armchair internet economists are the worst.
President Trump is a white supremacist.

Spoiler:
We've been over this many times, but since some people like to pretend we haven't, I'm using my sig as a place to list the fairly obvious examples of treating whites as superior to others.

Now, when lazy and disingenuous people try to claim ignorance, I'm 100% entitled to dismissing them as lazy or disingenuous. Hope it helps!

The short list
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  #7  
Old 09-16-2019, 12:31 PM
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Jasper, many FEE ONLY financial planners will give you 1 hour of their time at no charge each year for a high level review. all of the good ones do this

it's imperative to understand clearly how the advisor is compensated. you want someone who is clearly a fiduciary.

start looking here: https://www.napfa.org/
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  #8  
Old 09-16-2019, 12:32 PM
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Sounds good. Words much appreciated.
__________________
I'm not a bad Jasp! I'm just misunderstood.

The revAOlution will be complete when the language is perfect.

Quote:
Originally Posted by William F. Buckley, Jr.
Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 09-17-2019, 04:12 PM
Father Mahoney Father Mahoney is offline
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I have a pretty low opinion of all these people. It reminds me of my favorite E-Trade commercial of all time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7SGsCrnh3y0
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  #10  
Old 09-19-2019, 05:23 PM
gielelou gielelou is offline
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Quote:
And are there any pop financial people worth listening to?
No, the only guy I trust on wall street is Mike Mayo who seems trustworthy based on his track record. Not sure if he is "pop" though.
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