actuary v teacher

[Vorian Atreides]

Originally Posted by DreamTheater

I see what you mean about the ''change the education world''. I'm not one of those people. I'm not trying to change the world. I just know that I can do a better a job than a lot of the teachers out there and I have a strong, strong, strong passion for doing this. Unfortunately, I'll have a math degree, not an education degree and NCLB claims me inadequate.

You're assuming that you're going to have a free hand in what you teach and how you teach it. (Good luck finding a school district* who will support you in that endeavor.)

And you'll have to realize that if you go teach in a public school, classroom management is going to take more of your time/energy (at least early on). Especially if you're going to go through those programs you mentioned earlier. (Although, I think you'll get considerable support on this aspect with those programs.)





* There are plenty of district who will let their tenured/experienced teacher do this, within limits. But I doubt that they'll let a noob have such a free hand given the constraints of NCLB on funding individual schools.

[tude]

Based on OP's sentiment, be a teacher and take exams on the side (I've seen many teachers do this).

[Vorian Atreides]

Agree with DTNF's statement earlier . . . do one; if you don't like it, switch.

However, switching from teaching to actuary will likely be a bit more difficult since you'll have the additional obstacle of addressing why you want to switch. Passing Exams in the interim will help mitigate this, as will putting in 3-5 years as a teacher, but you'll still need to address this question.

Going from actuary to teacher will be much easier (even accounting for NCLB certifications) since you'll definitely find school districts with openings (especially for math) that are just happy to get a warm body with some sort of creditials. Having experience in the corporate environment will actually make some of your classroom management aspects a bit easier (vis-a-vis, speaking from experience about what the real world is really like).

Also note that you're not going to be making much money no matter what level you end up teaching. I've taught for nearly 10 years at every level from middle school through college. The reason I changed was that I couldn't support a family on just a teacher income and what my wife could earn.

I've enjoyed both sides . . . teaching (in spite of the NCLB politics) and actuarial. In fact, I still maintain connections with education through volunteer work with the Actuarial Foundation. After getting FCAS, I plan on creating Exam study materials and teaching for CAS Exams 5 (and maybe 6).

[CalculatinFool]

Man, actuaries are super good at pointing out all the RISKS and PITFALLS of just about ANYTHING that isn't actuarial. Afraid of everything they prefer the safety and predictablility of their dull spreadsheet analysis marathons. I get you! Your passion is MATH. Don't listen to a WORD these dullards and fearmongers are throwing about. TEACH! I'm a father. I have a family. We're not wealthy but we are extremely happy and healthy and we wake up most days full of enthusiasm for the day's work.

For crying out loud, it's annoying how these guys try to paint every school in the dismal image of their own experiences. Ummm, there are great schools to teach in .... in America...not just in Asia where I am. If not your local govt schools look into private schools. If you're good at what you do, the best schools will hire you. Just keep teaching, creating and sharing. You will be paid well if your efforts are valued and they WILL be valued if your head and heart are fully committed.

[mathmajor]

I graduated with a B.S. in Math and went on to get a teaching Master's so that I could get credentialed. I couldn't stand the coursework to get credentialed. It wasn't challenging or interesting at all, and there were a ton of hoops to jump through in addition to the cost. I still like the idea of teaching, and I occasionally tutor on the side. It might have been a more fulfilling job, but I wouldn't have made squat. And these days, teaching math isn't exactly a guarantee of getting a job on your terms. I'm glad I went down the actuarial path, especially since passing exams has come to me easily, but it just depends on what's important to you.

[Vorian Atreides]

sez da calc'n'fo' who paints a dismal picture of the actuarial profession with a limited experience on just one side of da fence.

And there are good school districts in America where it's a pleasure to teach (I currently live in one). The problem with these districts (wrt noob teachers) is that there are very few open positions and you'd be competing against experienced teachers who are trying to get in there as well.

If the OP is planning on sitting for Exams while teaching, this will put an extreme limit on which districts the OP can apply to. The fact of the matter is that

Pr(getting an offer from a challenging school district) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Pr(getting an offer from an ideal school district).

And if the OP is opting for the teaching route, they best do so for reasons other than the $$.

Originally Posted by CalculatinFool

Man, actuaries are super good at pointing out all the RISKS and PITFALLS of just about ANYTHING that isn't actuarial. Afraid of everything they prefer the safety and predictablility of their dull spreadsheet analysis marathons. I get you! Your passion is MATH. Don't listen to a WORD these dullards and fearmongers are throwing about. TEACH! I'm a father. I have a family. We're not wealthy but we are extremely happy and healthy and we wake up most days full of enthusiasm for the day's work.

For crying out loud, it's annoying how these guys try to paint every school in the dismal image of their own experiences. Ummm, there are great schools to teach in .... in America...not just in Asia where I am. If not your local govt schools look into private schools. If you're good at what you do, the best schools will hire you. Just keep teaching, creating and sharing. You will be paid well if your efforts are valued and they WILL be valued if your head and heart are fully committed.

[phoebe]

Originally Posted by CalculatinFool

Man, actuaries are super good at pointing out all the RISKS and PITFALLS of just about ANYTHING that isn't actuarial. Afraid of everything they prefer the safety and predictablility of their dull spreadsheet analysis marathons. I get you! Your passion is MATH. Don't listen to a WORD these dullards and fearmongers are throwing about. TEACH! I'm a father. I have a family. We're not wealthy but we are extremely happy and healthy and we wake up most days full of enthusiasm for the day's work.

For crying out loud, it's annoying how these guys try to paint every school in the dismal image of their own experiences. Ummm, there are great schools to teach in .... in America...not just in Asia where I am. If not your local govt schools look into private schools. If you're good at what you do, the best schools will hire you. Just keep teaching, creating and sharing. You will be paid well if your efforts are valued and they WILL be valued if your head and heart are fully committed.

Yes, there are good schools in the US that hire teachers. But I'm surprised you complain about not being able to do MATH as an actuary. The math a high school math teacher does isn't any more sophisticated than the math I do in my job. Both are heavily geared towards high school algebra, in fact.

I'm glad you like your job. It's a job I have seriously considered getting into, because I really like to teach. And I understand that you found your actuarial job unsatisfying. But I wonder if you may have just had a bad actuarial job or something. None of the arguments you make against the field seem very robust.

[JoshChicago]

Originally Posted by DreamTheater

I just know that I can do a better a job than a lot of the teachers out there and I have a strong, strong, strong passion for doing this.

As soon as you do a better job than other teachers the administration will attack you constantly. Yes, bad teachers are a major problem. But the other half of that problem is that good teachers are strongly suppressed.

[Vorian Atreides]

Originally Posted by JoshChicago

As soon as you do a better job than other teachers the administration tenured teachers will attack you constantly. Yes, bad teachers are a major problem. But the other half of that problem is that good teachers are strongly suppressed.

I've found this fix to be more accurate . . . although it will often manifest itself through the administration.

[extrovertedactuary]

Originally Posted by nonlnear

The future prospects of post-secondary careers are in rapid decline. Tenured positions are rapidly being replaced with sessional instructors, and pay for tenured positions is going down. Not staying stagnant, it's going down. If you can get a tenured position in a department you like at a pay you are content with you can still have a happy career, but beware the path to tenure is long and may necessitate many family-unfriendly choices.
This sound like a prelude to a crushed soul. It's basically six of one...

JoshChicago Quote:
Originally Posted by DreamTheater
I just know that I can do a better a job than a lot of the teachers out there and I have a strong, strong, strong passion for doing this.


As soon as you do a better job than other teachers the administration will attack you constantly. Yes, bad teachers are a major problem. But the other half of that problem is that good teachers are strongly suppressed.



Wow! There is some crappy advice in this thread. Nonlnear, this could be true for the areas of study/research that bring very little value to anyone such as history and the likes. Salaries for business faculty are rising and demand for business faculty also is rising.

And JoshChicago, come on! The administration will not attack you constantly unless you teach students the same shit you are preaching on this forum. Maybe you have noticed some unfortunate trends in your school district, but do not mislead posters here with your bull shit.