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  #1  
Old 04-26-2004, 10:19 AM
vegas vegas is offline
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Default Aggregate Deductibles

Can any reccomend a good source on developing aggregate deductible. E.g. you are selling a comm auto policy to a car dealership which has 100 cars. They want to buy a comp policy with $500 per car / $2500 per occurence deductibles. You have already developed per car deuctible factors, assuming no aggregates. Is there an easy way to now lay in an aggregate?
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Old 04-26-2004, 01:02 PM
PAC PAC is offline
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Try I.S.O.
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Old 04-27-2004, 08:47 AM
joeorez joeorez is offline
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Default Aggregate deductibles

May I modestly suggest the CAS syllabus readings for parts 3 and 4? Every now and then, the syllabus actually does have something that might be useful to work.
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Old 04-27-2004, 09:20 AM
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TwistedMentat TwistedMentat is offline
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In case joe's sarcasm goes unnoticed, I will add a more direct comment.

If you are one of those people who complains that the exam material has nothing to do with your work, perhaps you aren't doing your work as well as you could be doing it.
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Old 04-27-2004, 02:28 PM
Thirty Second Countdown Thirty Second Countdown is offline
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Default Re: Aggregate Deductibles

Quote:
Originally Posted by vegas
Is there an easy way to now lay in an aggregate?
Hey vegas,

If I lend you a few bucks, maybe you can go buy a clue. Ever heard of a little concept called .... actuarial exams?

Maybe if you spent a little more time studying and a little bit less time cyberfarting around.....
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Old 04-27-2004, 02:44 PM
patty_griffin patty_griffin is offline
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Default This is interesting

here is a funny quote from Vegas giving advice to someone considering the profession:

"Unless you want to spend the next 6 - 10 years of your life taking exams that have little to do with your job, do something else."

from this thread:
http://actuary.ca/phpBB/viewtopic.ph...201&highlight=

Vegas - my advice is 1) don't give advice to others based on your obviously limited experience and 2) maybe get someone else in your dept. to work on the agg. deductible project who spends less time on the internet and more time learning and doing the things that real actuaries do.

Just a girls thoughts on a sunny day...
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Old 04-27-2004, 04:33 PM
Thirty Second Countdown Thirty Second Countdown is offline
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You were griping on this bb about how the exams are useless and not relevant to an actuary's work.

Then, you had to come grovelling onto the P&C board and ask a question about how to perform an actuarial function.

At that point, it was clear to everyone that you would have known the answer to that question had you bothered to learn the information on the actuarial syllabus.

Now you know that you were wrong, and that exams are useful to an actuary, and that you can't do your job because you don't know the exam materials.

You were just served up a major, major facial. I hope you learn from this.

Regards,

Francis
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Old 04-27-2004, 10:51 PM
Steve White Steve White is offline
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As a member of the SOA (and formerly joint) Course 3 committee, in fairness to vegas this question goes well beyond Course 3. We would deal with either per car or aggregate deductibles, but rarely if ever with a combination of a per car and a per occurrence deductible. We would deal with evaluating either from loss distributions (but not from raw data; fitting the distribution to the data would be Course 4). For his primary question "can you use per car deductible results to derive aggregate deductible results?", the general answer from Course 3 would be no, you've got to go back to the underlying distributions. If there are any techniques to go directly from one to the other, he wouldn't learn them in Course 3.
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Old 04-28-2004, 07:08 AM
vegas vegas is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve White
As a member of the SOA (and formerly joint) Course 3 committee, in fairness to vegas this question goes well beyond Course 3. We would deal with either per car or aggregate deductibles, but rarely if ever with a combination of a per car and a per occurrence deductible. We would deal with evaluating either from loss distributions (but not from raw data; fitting the distribution to the data would be Course 4). For his primary question "can you use per car deductible results to derive aggregate deductible results?", the general answer from Course 3 would be no, you've got to go back to the underlying distributions. If there are any techniques to go directly from one to the other, he wouldn't learn them in Course 3.
Finally someone who understands Actuarial work. Perhaps the other people posting in this thread spend their day doing simple arithmetic and applying rote formulas to determine factors that are irrelavant to the questions being asked. But me, I try to do things right.

Obviously one could go back to the underlying distributions. Given limited data, fitting a curve may not be a viable option. That is the situation I am faced with. I'm sorry it doesn't fit into Patti's perfect world where one can just blindly apply to a formula and an answer spits out. However, this is not an exam, it is the real world.

Now, I will directly respond to the comments already given....

PAC - ISO has this in the works. That means it will be 3 - 5 years before we see anything. I did check with them before posting here.

Joe - I passed exams 3 & 4, so I know my issue is not covered on the syllabus. Perhaps you should go back an re-read the papers yourself.

Twisted - If you are one of those people who believe the exams are the end-all of learning, perhaps you shouldn't be an actuary (perhaps your aren't).

Edgeworth's - Keep your trolling in the non-actuarial sections.

Patti - I stick by that comment (given the context). The posts here prove that most people do not know what was tested on exams 3 & 4. Thanks for helping me justify my comment. Exams 3 & 4 (and part 9) give some very good information on deductibles. Unfortunately none of them directly deal with the situation I have here or can't be applied given data constraints.

Thanks for all the sound advice.......
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  #10  
Old 04-28-2004, 08:04 AM
joeorez joeorez is offline
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Default Parts 3 and 4

Quote:
Originally Posted by vegas
.

Joe - I passed exams 3 & 4, so I know my issue is not covered on the syllabus. Perhaps you should go back an re-read the papers yourself.
If you are asking, is this material lifted directly from page 47 of one of the readings, the answer is no.

But from the Klugman and Ross readings, you should have enough background on loss functions and distributions to make some assumptions, create some distributions, and calculate the loss function you are looking for.

Or, are you saying that Parts 3 and 4 do not prepare someone to do this?
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