
12-10-2004, 02:56 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2001
Favorite beer: Early and Often
Posts: 66,526
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Originally Posted by gomer_tree
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Originally Posted by Harry
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Originally Posted by Paul Brand
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Originally Posted by Harry
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Originally Posted by Paul Brand
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Originally Posted by MNBridge
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Originally Posted by MNBridge
The teacher took his watch and put in in a box. He said the chance of the universe being like it is through 'luck' would be smaller than the chance of him taking his watch appart shaking the box and having it end up back together. At this I immediately thought "But the parts have to end up some way" and I could say the same thing about each of those ways. So you proved nothing.
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Did you miss the point the Sunday School teacher was making here? The watch is not reall ya watch it's the ........ never mind.
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The point was that random processes don't put a watch together. He uses this as an analogy to life on earth. Did you miss this? You counter that a random process will produce something guaranteed. I counter that while that is true, everything else you produce is meaningless. I believe this was implied by your Sunday School teacher. My point is that if this is the reason why you rejected theism, you didn't choose a very good reason.
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I thought the point was that in the random process, the probability of getting a working watch is the same as the probability of any of the other possible configurations?
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That was MN's point, which I countered above.
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How so? How do you know that a random process can't put a watch together if all the parts are there?
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It's funny. Atheists will argue how illogical an unreasoned religious people can be, and then I read stuff like this.
It's like saying that if I walk halfway to a wall, and then go halfway again, and then halfway again, etc. there are an infinite number of halves. Since I could never walk an infinite number of halves in my lifetime, I will never reach the wall.
It's nice logic, but it's simply wrong.
Shaking the parts of a watch will NEVER make a watch, if someone is evaluating this with any modicum of reason. It's not simply a matter of "all the parts landing in the right spot." It's about actual different actions that need to take place, such as screwing in the tiny screws, snapping on gears, whatever. There's this theoretical possibility that is simply, in practicality, a zero probablility.
Yet, you guys of the enlightened philosophical and scientific thought will argue basicall any point - no matter how ludicrous - to make yourselves happy.
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gomer, it's a bad analagy. Finding faults with the analagy is not the same as finding faults with the real thing.
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I think the dollar will crash irreparably by 2012.... bottom drops out of the dollar. ....Dollars are worthless, 401ks are bust, the markets are valueless...government assumes control over all industry and everything is nationalized by the end of 2012. - gomer_tree
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