Degradation of the actuarial designation

[campbell]

Gotta second that =snort=.

I've known too many PhDs to care what they think of the designation. Truth is, most of them have never heard of the designation. Those who have even heard of actuaries probably don't know there are two different series of exams.

Even if the FAP exams are easier in terms of pass rates (like, say... oh... Course 7 and PD), that doesn't make the prelim exams easier or exams DP and CSP easier. So maybe ASA is a little easier, but I doubt getting an FSA is easier, as many other people have noted.

Lastly, are we going to start the "They're outsourcing our jobs! Waaaaah!" whine again? Let's just not go there and say we did, okay?

[DW Simpson]

Originally Posted by campbell

Lastly, are we going to start the "They're outsourcing our jobs! Waaaaah!" whine again? Let's just not go there and say we did, okay?

We can just jump to the FAQ outsourcing section: http://www.actuarialoutpost.com/actu...4&postcount=28

That's fair.

[Tobias Funke]

When they start considering giving away FSA to career ASA's, run.

[Kabaka]

Originally Posted by SirVLCIV

:snort:

Originally Posted by campbell

Gotta second that =snort=.

I've known too many PhDs to care what they think of the designation. Truth is, most of them have never heard of the designation. Those who have even heard of actuaries probably don't know there are two different series of exams.

Even if the FAP exams are easier in terms of pass rates (like, say... oh... Course 7 and PD), that doesn't make the prelim exams easier or exams DP and CSP easier. So maybe ASA is a little easier, but I doubt getting an FSA is easier, as many other people have noted.

Lastly, are we going to start the "They're outsourcing our jobs! Waaaaah!" whine again? Let's just not go there and say we did, okay?

:snort: again. Yah, this designation is way too easy. I just breezed through 3 passes and 3 fails in the last 3 years.

[Nutty Buddy]

Originally Posted by RealSix

..well I guess I was exaggerating a little, but I really was scared when I saw in 2003 what they were proposing, and was thinking that I better do something.

I have just left to get another degree.

When did they become easier? 2005.

Please explain.

Last I saw the field IS being flooded! Have you heard of China and India?

I am starting to think this is a conspiracy by insurance company executives to get cheaper labor, and mark my words, the labor will become cheaper. If that's the case then there are a number of SOA member in the SOA executive who have in essence "sold out" their brethren, no doubt for self serving reasons!

God bless CAS for not doing the same. We're all going to be switching to CAS soon.

Thus flooding the CAS field, driving down the price of labor, putting you in, well, exactly the same boat as you were before!

The flooding doesn't come from more people passing that wouldn't have passed before due to a higher pass rate, it comes from more people taking the exams and proving they are competent.

[Kabaka]

Last I saw the field IS being flooded! Have you heard of China and India?

I am starting to think this is a conspiracy by insurance company executives to get cheaper labor, and mark my words, the labor will become cheaper. If that's the case then there are a number of SOA member in the SOA executive who have in essence "sold out" their brethren, no doubt for self serving reasons!

God bless CAS for not doing the same. We're all going to be switching to CAS soon.

And its really too bad that those countries totalling ~ 2 billion people won't have need of a single actuary, especially as they're developing into financial strongholds. I guess they'll all come over here.

[Smooth Criminal]

Originally Posted by RealSix

..well I guess I was exaggerating a little, but I really was scared when I saw in 2003 what they were proposing, and was thinking that I better do something.

I have just left to get another degree.

When did they become easier? 2005.

Why do we care if phd’s respect us? Well, for one thing that is a great compliment, and I don’t know about you, but I like complements. More importantly, if phd’s respect us, then it’s easier to convince company management that we are worth $$, even if it is all BS.

Who cares if the designation was falsely valued in the first place!! That's the beauty of it! What kind of idiots raise their hands and say, "you know what I really shouldn't be paid this much."

Last I saw the field IS being flooded! Have you heard of China and India?

I am starting to think this is a conspiracy by insurance company executives to get cheaper labor, and mark my words, the labor will become cheaper. If that's the case then there are a number of SOA member in the SOA executive who have in essence "sold out" their brethren, no doubt for self serving reasons!

God bless CAS for not doing the same. We're all going to be switching to CAS soon.

good post

[Nutty Buddy]

Originally Posted by RealSix

..well I guess I was exaggerating a little, but I really was scared when I saw in 2003 what they were proposing, and was thinking that I better do something.

Like finish your FSA, that thing you apprarently feel is being "devalued" so much?

Here's my situation:
I have 20 unassigned PD credits from 110 (anybody remember this exam) in 1999.

It is my understanding that I can start PD and use it for FSA. (I haven't used PD for ASA) Further, I believe I don't have to do a project.

http://www.actuarialoutpost.com/actu...10&postcount=1

Pick a side, buddy, and either appreciate the FSA or don't. Don't come whining about how much harder you had it way back in 1999.

[rrr3221]

Originally Posted by RealSix

Is anyone else out there worried about these 90% pass rates on the new exams?

Do you think this is just short sighted (or blind) political maneuvering by the current leaders in the society or is there a well thought out reason for (apparently) making the exams easier?

It's very simple. You know how you raise prices when the cycle is low and lower prices when the cycle is up? The SOA now is lowering the prices because the cycle is up. They need more people!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

ps. I am not a hired actuary, so I kind of made this as I went.

[RealSix]

I personally do value it. That's not the issue.

I am not saying all this stuff implies the preliminary exams are easier. This ardent belief of mine is implied by other propositions:

1) Same # of prelim exams , each with 1/2 the material as in the 2000 system. - come on, that was one of the b_tches about the 2000 system, that there was just so much stuff on each exam - how could the new exams be anywhere near as hard unless they are really making the questions quite trickier, which in light of everything else that has been revealed, is highly doubtful.

2) FM with pass rate 50 -70%

3) FAP with pass rate 90% (okay doesn't directly apply to preliminary exams, but does stand as evidence of what Bruce and Buhlmann have claimed - that they want to make the whole thing easier)

4)What these guys have admitted ( the above in brackets – making the whole thing easier)

..all adds up the, pretty safe, assumption that everything is being dumbed down! Now I admit that I have the tendency to be pretty dumb myself, but I managed to make it through the 2000 system. I am scare to think of who is getting through now.